Pillowsoft crumb-technique?

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clazar123 on 20 Jul 2009 at 08:02

I guess pillow soft is a good description of what I want to achieve. When you squeeze-test a package of these buns, they feel like a pillow you would sleep on.Depresses easily but has bounceback. I'm not talking "store-bought" guar gum,air injected buns,stick-like-wallpaper paste-to-the-roof-of-your-mouth kind of buns. I have seen soft sandwich buns at a local organic, flour,water,yeast,salt,starter kind of bakery.It is easy to get a bite without all the filling squishing out.  Of course, they don't want to talk about technique-then I wouldn't buy their buns. My bread crumb turns out chewier-it's good but I want to be able to achieve the soft bun.

I have sifted this site numberous times and I'm missing something because I'm not able to achieve this. I have tried adding:potatoes, milk,eggs and oil after various posters suggested that. Delicious experiments but still not there. I have to believe it is a technique or hydration issue rather than an ingredient issue. I have always used either Better for Bread (Gold MedalBrand) flour or AP flour for these endeavors. I also use a KitchenAid stand mixer and favor using sourdough with a little additional yeast due to time constraints (I bake on weekends).

So, how does one achieve a pillowy crumb and a crust that is thin and easy to bite off without being tough?

 

Try Norm's Semi-Flat Onion Buns. You don't have to put the onions on the top. That bun was very soft on the outside and fluffy on the inside.

--Pamela

pjkobulnicky on 20 Jul 2009 at 12:59

Lots of yeast with a highly hydrated dough will give you what you want. If you don't like the taste of lots of yeast, then do a sponge the evening before. I usually do my sponge with 1/3 of the final flour and an equal part of water by weight (so I know how much to add the next day). To this sponge add a teeny amount of yeast (1/16 or 1/32 OF A tsp). You then get a lot of "natural" yeast development. When you put the dough together the next day, add another teaspoon of yeast (for a couple of pounds of dough).

I only recently began experimenting with the affect Whole Wheat flour has on my bread.  Yesterday I used a 1/3 whole wheat 60% hydration starter (actually a 50/50 mix of my old starter and whole wheat flour/water that fermented in the fridge for about four days) and 2/3 AP flour, with about 1 1/2% active dry yeast and 1% salt.    The final hydration was somewhere between 67 and 70% and I used a stretch and fold kneading technique (the method that includes slamming the dough on the counter to stretch it out and kneading it a dozen or more times after each folding action) and ended up with a somewhat sticky dough that would not hold its shape without longitudinal support.  Baked on stone at 425 to internal temp. of 210 degrees.  Oven spring was enormous and I was surprised to find the pillowy texture inside the firm crisp crust.  Inasmuch as I've used this combination of ingredients and technique, sans whole wheat flour, in the past, I have to conclude that the whole wheat flour was the source of the ultimate texture I enjoyed.

[URL=http://s304.photobucket.com/albums/nn169/topturner/?action=view&current=Crumb.jpg][/URL]

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And have you done this with sourdough? 

I avoid the recipes with large amounts of yeast-I really don't like the flavor but the thought of a sponge to develop bread flavor is something I haven't done in eons. I can handle the night before baking  prep-it's the 3 day type of recipe I also avoid-not enough time.

Flournwater, I hope the internal temp was a little higher than 110F (say 190) and I'm glad your loaf turned out so nicely. I usually make 70% whole wheat sandwich bread but my hydration is not that high. I should try and increase the hydration just to see if the solution was right under my nose.

 

Oooops ....  thanks for the heads up, clazar123.  I hate those typos that I miss when I proof read.  I've either got to learn to type with fewer errors or proof read more accurately.  That's the second time in two days.