Reviving a starter from fridge

Reviving a starter from fridge that is roughly 6 months old, and at the same time it's never really been strong enough to raise bread. I say this because I've used this starter (ischia) probably a dozen times now and have not been getting good oven spring. After reading several very educational posts on this forum I think I've realized that there must be a weak yeast population going on. I think its diluted. This forum is great, I really appreciate and love to read about the science of fermenation and what people are doing out there with sourdough starters. I am more of a pizza dough guy but have been baking bread religiously for 2 years now, while gaining much knowledge from this site. Mainly enriched and yeasted breads, well, and delicious too. I should mention that I want to use a starter for qualities other than the sourness, I don't really have a taste for sour breads.

My starter uses pretty much KAAP, and I always feed it 1:1:1 ratios. I use it about twice per month but I'd like to start using it the right way and more often. Many starters out there are being fed rye, wheat or a variety and I've read that the rye really gets it active. I say I'm not using it the right way because my method has been to remove it from fridge, feed it 1:1:1 wait for it to almost double and then use it in dough. I've also built some levains but still I believe my starter is not strong enough, my breads are not rising a whole lot.

Last night I removed it from fridge and fed it a ratio of 1:1:1 and then let it sit 12 hours in roughly 68 deg F on the table. This morning around 6:00 am it hadn't moved too much. I fed it again at 1:2:2 (or close to it) and then put it a proofing box at 78 deg F. I just took a photo of it, it's 1:00 pm and it does not look very active. I think it's diluted.

What is my best course of action to get this thing raging? I'd like to store it in the fridge and remove some when I need to build a levain. Like maybe 3 or 4 times a month. I work full time, and am still working now because we are essential, but my family can step in and take care of it during the week if need be. Just not sure of what I should do. Please help and thanks in advance!

I’ve had exactly the same problem, using KA AP and an old starter, and the solution has always been time — both giving it time between ferments and refreshing several times until it gets going. After it’s been dormant in the back of my fridge, I have found it often takes 4 days or so, with 24 hours between refreshes to become really active. I wouldn’t mess with hydration or temperature. I’d just plan on using it next weekend rather than this one...

The longest I've let my starter go without a feeding is three weeks, but it was a strong starter to begin with. In the past, I had tried to get an initial starter going a couple of times, without success, and had just about given up, but then tried it with organic ground rye and it was active in just a couple days. Now for normal feeds, I usually use an AP/whole wheat/rye mix (at about 65/25/10 ratio) and use 100/100/100 ratio for the feeds (equal weights starter, flour and water). If you aren't seeing any signs of activity in your starter, like a lot of bubbles or rise, your starter might be dead or super weak. You could try feeding it with some ground rye, which I've read has the most amount of natural yeast on it, to kind of recharge it or you might need to just start completely over. I also get much better results when I plan a series of three daily feeds in the days leading up to my bake, as I usually keep my starter in the fridge for a couple days every week and just bake on the weekends. I get double to triple rise in the starter by approximately 6-8 hours...if you aren't seeing any evidence of a good rise and fall within 12 hours, and you haven't had good results during your last dozen attempts, you probably don't have a viable starter. You could try the ground rye 'boost' or go back to square one with a ground rye starter build. It's certainly no fun to go to all the trouble of making a loaf of bread only to have it turn out flat (I'v been there too). Good luck with everything!

What you are trying to do works absolutely fine, keeping it in the fridge and using once every few weeks, but if you keep it in there for more than 2 weeks you should probably bring it out and give it a couple of days feed and discard to get it properly going again before putting it back in the fridge, or it will slowly dwindle in vigour.

From where you are now, I’d take a couple of teaspoons of it and add to 5x the weight of flour and 5x the weight of water; and include abut 20% wholewheat in the feeds. Let that double in size (might take a couple of days), then start discarding and feeding 1:1:1. Wait until it’s reliably doubling in size after a feed before thinking about putting it back in the fridge... and when you are ready to put it back in, do so about 1-2hrs after feeding so it has a chance to get started.

You don't think 1:5:5 is overfacing a dormant starter? I'd be inclined to go the other way and feed 2:1:1 or even 3:1:1 until it is doubling within 12 hours. Too much food, and even more too much water, is going to give everything except the acid-tolerant bacteria a better chance at survival.

I was surprised too, but under similar conditions I was assured by others and it’s always worked for me when everything has got a bit sluggish. Well, hopefully the OP can let us know how they get on :)

Fair enough. If it works, it works. And yes, let's see how it turns out.

Thank you for the suggestions. The starter has been sitting on the counter since 1:00 this afternoon and it looks better and more active now, smells like yeast. It has some life in it! It sounds like I should give it a little more time and some stronger feeds. I know these things require patience and monitoring which is no problem, I'm keeping track of what I'm doing with this for future reference too. I'm going to increase the feed and include some whole wheat, give these creatures a party. This sounds like a plan, awesome. Thanks I will keep you posted, much appreciated. I've attached a photo of what it looks like now.

Party time ;-)

This morning at 6:30am this is what it looked like after sitting in proof box at 70 deg F since 8:30 last night. It just about doubled. Smells pretty good too. For some reason I proceeded to do something dumb, I think, I removed some and fed it 1:2:2 starter flour water. I added some whole wheat as well but mainly KAAP. Now it's not doing anything. I should have maintained another 1:5:5, or just let it sit longer. I guess now I'll just let it sit in the proof box until it doubles hopefully.

I think if you keep it in the proof box it’ll use its food up too fast, and you’ll find that the LAB grows faster than the yeast... I recommend just keeping it at room temp.

Don’t sweat it... Nothing wrong with feeding at 1:1:1 or 1:2:2, indeed that’s probably the right thing to do, now it’s perked up. Equally there is nothing wrong with letting it get a bit hungry for half the day, unless you’re really getting ready to bake with it.

I fed it last night a ratio of 1:2:2 and left it on the counter where the ambient temp is about 69° F. Used mainly KAAP but added a little whole wheat.

This morning it didn't show a lot of activity as of 5:30 am but it does have a few bubbles on the surface. Currently it is still sitting on the counter, I think it should sit another 12 hours perhaps without doing anything.

Once it shows activity and has doubled I'll remove some and re-feed it. Just not sure if it should be 1:5:5 or 1:2:2?

I would recommend you let it completely use up the food you’ve given it before giving it more: So let it come to a peak (double or whatever) and then collapse right back down, before feeding it again - I suggest 1:1:1 or 1:2:2, whichever means you only have to feed it once per 24h.

So last night I discarded some and then fed the new batch 1:3:3 with 15% whole wheat and the rest KAAP. (The feed before this was 24 hours prior)

This morning at 5:30 it looked pretty decent, better than it did yesterday morning at the same time. I didn't feed it yet today, going to let it stay on the counter until this evening again. I'll feed it then most likely, same thing.

I believe this is building the yeast population hopefully. If I maintain this schedule, will it get stronger? The photo is what it looked like this morning.

Thanks,

Gary

that seems to be working :) I think you are wise to leave it alone through today, and just feed it again tonight - do the same thing, and see if it responds the same way. But before you feed it, test a little on your tongue to see how sour it tastes. Also if there are still bubbles in it, then it's probably not used up all its existing food during the day so you should reduce the feed a little (try 1:2:2 for example).

Changing too many things at the same time, or making changes too frequently, is a common error and makes it very hard to understand what's really helping. Try to keep good notes...

I've been on the 24 hour schedule with it for 3 days now. Kept it the same ratio at 1:3:3 each time and using 15% WW. I feed it usually around 7:00 or 8:00 pm. I also tasted it prior to the feed. It had a pungent sourness that really hits you.

I then decided to drop the feed down to 1:2:2 because it still had bubbles on the surface and there were no signs of it hitting a peak and falling back down. Everything else I kept the same, just changed the ratio to 1:2:2. Here it is prior to the feed last night. What should I do with the feeding ratio/schedule at this point, maintain it? Thanks!