hello!
I started my first starter about two weeks ago with whole wheat flour and it failed. It was going well for the first five days, and then it just stopped. Now 2 weeks later and it just sits there- very little activity.
So, I've read that Rye often works better as a starter. I'm on day 2 and it looks great- filled with air bubbles and puffed up. I fed it once - 4 ounces of flour and 4 ounces water once and 4 and 4 originally. It's almost outrowing my container (mason jar).
So my questions:
1. Should I move it to a larger container and keep feeding it 4 and 4? Should I discard 8 ounces tomorrow morning before adding 4 and 4? Or change the amounts altogether?
2. It's a lot thicker than my whole wheat starter was. Is this normal for rye? Should I change my ratio?
3. Once it (hopefully!) passes the float test, can I use it to bake with any kind of flour? I would like to bake with Einkorn. Do I have to make a new starter with Einkorn flour or can I use my Rye starter to leaven the Einkorn flour?
Any other tips and tricks would be helpful and greatly appreciated! I'm totally green and clueless here!
thank you!
That unless you did something seriously wrong, which I'm sure you didn't, this quiet period you experienced wasn't stopping. It's perfectly normal but recipes rarely warn you of this. I'm guessing that instead of slowing down your feeds you carried on and even increased them in order to encourage your starter. The trick is, at this stage, is to slow down the feeds and keep warm. When your starter picks up again then you carry on feeding. So bearing that in mind...
1. Carry on but no need to build so much. Can easily be done with half the amount. I would, at this stage, keep 2 ounces and feed 2 ounces of water + 2 ounces of flour. If your starter suddenly stops after a feed then stop feeding. Keep warm and just stir every now and again. When it begins to pick up again but still seems a bit slow then keep 3 ounces and feed 1.5 ounces water + 1.5 ounces flour. When it becomes stronger and more reactive then go back to 2+2+2 ounces.
2. No. 100% hydration is fine. Rye would seem thicker as it absorbs more water. In reality there's no one correct hydration but for now stick to weighing and keep it 100% hydration for ease.
3. No need to build a whole new starter. Take a little off, feed it with einkorn and allow it to mature. Now you have an einkorn starter. If you don't want too much rye in your einkorn starter then start off with a small amount of rye starter and feed with a larger percentage of Einkorn. If you are a purist then give it a few feeds turning it into a 100% einkorn starter.
4. First get your starter going and off the ground :)
thank you so much!
i did add feeds, then read to stop. So i stopped and it's sitting now, a few tiny bubbles, no rise- it never rose as much as the 2 day old Rye one is. I started almost 3 weeks ago (about 2.5) and it never passed the float test. I've kept it in the hopes it will come back. Its sitting on top of the fridge now next to the Rye one.
so when I go to bake - I can just use 2 tablespoons with my Einkorn flour and leave it overnight to leaven if Im not a purist and don't care if theres a bit of Rye in my loaf? Or do I have to start a new starter with the einkorn?
thanks again - there is SO much conflicting info on the interwebs about this! ------
are you using 4oz each by weight of flour and water, or 4 oz by volume (fluid ounces) of flour and water?
If by weight, then you are doing it perfectly for keeping a 100% hydration starter, but if by volume then you should be using half the volume of water as you do flour (for example: 4 oz - 1/2 cup - flour, and 2 oz - 1/4 cup - water). Most of us keep track in weight by grams - since that way it is immediately obvious that it is a weight measure, the amount is equal for the flour and water, and it's also much easier to do smaller amounts without having to play with decimals or fractions.
It sounds like you're definitely on the right track with your starters, so I just wondered if maybe the lack of visible activity in the original wheat starter might be that it was done by equal volume instead of equal weight, giving you too much liquid for things to really get going.
Otherwise, Lechem will give you perfect advice for getting the starter going --- and make sure you pop back with any questions or concerns as you get it up and running and baking!
I'm using a kitchen scale and measuring 4 ounces - is that wrong? Most of the recipes I read gave me measurements in ounces, not grams. I can't get over how much thicker the Rye starter is and how much it's grown in 36 hours. I hope it keeps up!
What temperature is the intending starter?
The cooler it is from 24°C or 75°F the longer it takes.
Edit: Well that is odd. When I posted this Q, all the other posts came tumbling in at the same time. Still want to know the temperature.
As for Einkorn, make a separate Einkorn starter, takes about 5 days but is a greater improvement to an Einkorn loaf if that is where this is headed. The starter itself will let you know when it is ready to use. Practically a no fuss starter.
Rye absorbs more water than wheat so it will be thicker than a wheat mixture with the same amount of water.
You can easily play with any weight of flour and slowly add more water to explore hydration. Weight of water divided by weight of flour x 100 gives % hydration. Try with different flours and compare them. Notice how doughy or more batter like they become. Stick a straw in them and blow a few bubbles and watch how the surface stretches. ...or not.
so Mini Oven- my house is at 74 and it's on top of the fridge, so I'm guessing 75-78.
so the Rye starter was going like gangbusters day 2-3. It rose like crazy, almost busted out of the top of the jar, and passed the float test on day 3.
so I took some out at made an einkorn starter with it. The einkorn starter hasn't risen (4 days later) but it is bubbly and foamy.
Meanwhile, my awesome Rye starter is now completely lifeless. I fed it 2 and 2 on day 4, after taking some out, and no rise, no bubbles. Fed it 36 hours later, no rise, no bubbles. Just fed it again this morning after 36 more hours.
why does this keep happening???? Days 1-4 are great and then...nothing. Ugh. I feel so imcompetent at this point. Any help is appreciated!
isn't my einkorn starter rising? It's much thinner and more like pancake batter than the Rye starter (and I'm doing 2 and 2 for both).
It's now very bubbly and foamy on top and I can see bubbles throughout. I fed it yesterday around 6 am. No rise. Didn't pass the float test this morning.
should I feed it again today? Just stir it? feed it with Rye and einkorn? I am so lost!
Use less water (thicken it up), don't feed until it has a significant rise. Stirring won't hurt.
it is hard to tell what is going on. A rye starter going gangbusters on day 2/3 doesn't sound right, not at 76°F.
Set off some of your water into a pitcher to stand a day before using to feed starters. Get yourself a can or bottle of unsweetened pineapple juice to use in place of water for the start up phase of the culture. When yeast appear, the juice can be replaces with water. Juice should lower the pH and acidify the starter to help get over the bacterial foam up stage that seems to be taking so long in your starters.
You also need to understand what you are looking for in the starters and how to interpret what they are saying to you. The first starter or two seem to always be the hardest because you are learning a new language from organisms that are too small to see. Read to get an idea of what is going on inside the starter.
http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/10901/pineapple-juice-solution-part-2
Then get back to us and tell us the current condition of all the starter mixtures.
Once yeast appear, the starter culture will demand to be fed turning the flour they have into alcohol. The kitchen will take on a beery aroma just from the yeast in the starter(s). So it will be rather obvious when yeast are growing. The daily spoon of flour will no longer be enough to keep them happily multiplying. Then you switch gears from growing a starter to maintaining a starter, an altogether different mentality and routine.
One of my early attempts with the Pineapple Juice Solution just would not take off. After a few days of frustration, I noticed the notation (in tiny letters) on the juice container that said "contains preservatives". Aargh!
After starting anew with preservative-free juice, things were bubbling happily in just two or three daya.
Paul