Those of us who have volunteered to test recipes for Norm's book have received our first recipes. We have been asked to not share the recipes, naturally, but Stan has told me it's okay to post photos. It's a bit of a tease, I know, but, from another perspective, it's publicity for a much-anticipated project of two esteemed TFL members.
For those other recipe testers willing to share their own results, I propose using this topic to collect photos of your breads/pastries/cookies in one place.
My first recipe was for "Bakery Pan Challah." It is sinfully delicious fresh baked and as toast this morning, with butter and cherry-plum jam. I'm betting it will make fabulous French toast tomorrow morning, as well.
Here are some photos:
Loaf
Slices
Crumb
David
David
I brought some over to my MIL who normally kicks these out by the dozens before the Holidays. Rumor has it we might be switching the traditional formula this year. They really are good! Like a cross between a Linzer Torte and Linzer Augen!
Mouth feel, wait, I have to eat another one to check on that... moist but not quite falling apart, nutty, delicate, sweet from jam and tart too as a follow up as it melts on my tongue and then there is a little bit of caramel taste that makes me lick my chops and follow my tongue around my teeth releasing a smacking sound and searching for every crumb. Even the slightly darker cookies are keepers. The ones with 3 holes are traditional Linzer Augen (Eyes.) The crumbs remain a secret but very much like a jelly roll or pound cake.
Here's another shot:
That's a bread-and-butter plate they're on - they're not gigantic wheels of cals, as they appear. Nowhere near the finesse of Mini's, of course, but a very nice treat with a cup of tea or coffee.
They are so yummy!
Thanks Mini for providing this link. Now that I have the book and have this link it is wonderful to see all of the interesting and beautiful baked good being produced! So, no skiing today, BUT I have a coffee cake dough in the fridge to make those walnut Hungarian rolls in the morning, the second build for the classic Jewish NY Deli rye starting to get happy and a sponge started for a half recipe of the Bakery Challah. I have omitted the yeast and used about 10% sweet levain and 10% yeast water levain. The sponge included the levains, sugar, 130 g 90F water, 150 g strong bread flour and 65g egg yolks. It looks pretty bubbly and happy after an hour!
I will be interested in trying a different braiding style with this bread This dough is much like my beloved pulla, with WAY more egg and yolk and no cardamon -- sigh!
Busy day!
Happy baking folks! Brian
Gorgeous!
one question for you... how did you proceed for the cake crumbs? Did you bake a cake and dried it, used a store bought cake? Frozen cake? Which flavor?
I am a bit unsure of what to do, it seems like an awful lot of cake crumbs....
and added neutral low salt white bread crumbs to it. My MIL sugested Brioche crumbs when I asked if they had some at the bakery. What ever tastes good will also taste good in the cookies. Don't worry about it too much. The Konditor (Caker) uses all the little scraps from the cake edges for crumbs. So just about any cake or two will do. I baked one day, cooled and stacked the cookies inside plastic ware and continued with filling them the next day or whenever there is time. Once the cut out shapes are sprinkled with powdered sugar, it covers a multitude of irregularities. It doesn't all have to be done in one shot.
Mini
(I tried to edit but Stan was too fast.) I did buy a cake, it was cheap and saved me lots of time, granted, it is a cheap Austrian cake, low salt and similar to a pound cake. It's berry season and it was on sale. I cut it up and tried to dry it as much as I could but it stayed moist. It lost a little weight and I made up for it with dry bread crumbs. As Stan states, they are dryer than cake crumbs because cakes are enriched. I was worried the cake crumbs might be too moist and I might need more dry ingredients but they balanced each other nicely. Had I used less cake and more bread crumbs, I would have had to reduce the bread crumb amount.
(I wonder about those Japanese white bread crumbs, they are almost feathery...)
Mini
I do have Panko in the house...
do you think it's worth trying to use them, reducing the amount accordingly as Stan suggests? It would make my life a lot easier, and probably would not be that bad as a substitution to suggest for people who get the book. I know for a fact that a recipe that calls for cake crumbs would not go very well with me - I basically never bake a cake... (well, almost never... :-)
that she just posted. I understand we are going to need some more crumbs. It's sure to be a good one! We could nibble off some of the cake and then crumb the rest and freeze! It might even turn you into a cake person. I want to eat the crunchies off the top first. They look so gooood! Use a couple of bread pans and go for it!
http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/18304/baking-pound-cake-1964
Mini
(Lab Rat #1 just took a cookie and after the first bite, "Hey, these are good!" Then after a pause took out a plate, loaded it up and went back upstairs.)
Thanks for the pound cake reference, Mini! It has a very crunchy top but the cake part may be to moist..though you can crumble it. It's definately not a dry tasting or feeling pound cake and has a lovely creamy flavor.
Sylvia
I think I'll bake it tomorrow but it might not go for crumbs. I don't think it will live that long. I have a brand new bundt pan I want to test.
The cake I used for crumbs was also not dry, in fact it refused to dry out. I think the crumbs collecting in the cake shop kitchens comes from deliciously moist cakes too. Would they bake anything less?
Mini
Unfortunately, my cookies did not work at all.... :-(
the dough never firmed very well, I had to add more flour, still did not cooperate. I baked them, but would be embarrassed to show my results
Something went terribly wrong, I suspect the cake I bought was too moist or something - I dried it for two days, but still....
I used unsalted butter.
I didn't dry my cake crumbs at all. It was a very oily dough and I think there was way too much shortening in the recipe - so much so that it was unworkable until I added an extra 100gm of flour. How much did you add, I wonder?
Like Mini, I used unsalted butter, but ran out (!) and had to top up with canola oil.
The finished biscuits were still brittle and tending crumbly, as will always be the case when you have such a high fat content. I suspect the result would not have been up to much without the additional flour, but as things turned out, mine were delicious. Brought back nice memories of Christmas in Germany, probably due to the ground hazelnuts and cinnamon resonances.
Haven't taken any pics yet...will probably upload one tomorrow. Mine are never as elegant and aesthetically delightful as, say, Mini's, but I figure it's interesting to compare each other's bakes. Dunno about others, but I'm baking 'blind' with all these recipes so far. No cause for embarassment if things don't quite work out. Although, looking at my hamatashen compared with the others, I'm not immune from the feeling!
Cheers
Ross
you can't sub oil for shortening or any fat. oil will not firm in the fridg it will stay liqued ant even frezzer temp thats the reason for a sticky douth that will not firm.
shortening or butter will get hard at cold temps think what it would be like making a pie dough with oil.
please follow the formulas as written and mesure or scale with care and the formulas should work great.
remember these have never been in print before untell you count crumpled stained aging and torn hand written scraps of paper. some have never been written down at all they are only in my head as they have been passed down verbily from other bakers.
into the book "Do's and Don'ts" with substitutions.
Ross, keep in mind, I did't post the "other" cookies that didn't turn out well. If there is enough dough, I shape following the guidelines the best I can and then try a few ideas as well. You only get to see the cookies that "posed." The lot on the side have their own stories... the Hamatcallas and the Hamatsusans, the Briquettes, the Linzer-squished and Brokeback pieces from moving the cookies too soon off the hot sheet and finally the Almond-splits (I wonder if they aren't too high but that is Norm & Stan's job.) The only ones I've made before are the Linzer ones thank my Inlaws -- great teachers with the "Intro to Linz, Austria 101" course. The others are all new.
My main "Lab Rats" could care less how they look, important that they taste good. I keep wanting to make the cookies smaller... so I & others can try more cookies when presented with an assortment plate at Coffee Trinken Time. The tendancy in America is to make them big which is great for the bag lunch or the kids or the "grab and run" maneuver.
Mini
it is the ones that dont come out right are the ones we learn from. so please post them as well my fealings wont be hurt. it is a way or me to check the math and see what happened. both stan and i are checking very carefully. we don't want to end up with an error correction sheet like some other books.
The term 'shortening' is, I think, widely used in the States (don't know about England), but not so commonly in Australia. Here, instead of using the term shortening, recipes would simply specify 'butter', or 'copha' etc. I have used oil instead of butter/lard/copha etc many times in baking (not my choice - partner has health issues), and have never had a problem. This includes cakes, biscuits and the like. Not pies or pastries, though, which obviously do need butter or some sort of solid fat.
I am aware that you didn't want testers to substitute other ingredients, and as far as I was concerned, I was not substituting when I used oil to top up the butter after I ran out. I would have thought oil was as acceptable as butter, and only used butter because I think it tastes better in biscuits (and in most contexts, come to think about it!).
So, here's an instance of 'cultural confusion', for want of a better word. If you are anticipating a market for your book extending beyond the States (as I expect you are), I believe you need to make it clear in your recipes exactly what does and does not constitute 'shortening' (maybe just a note in the intro section would suffice?). It might even be worth putting the shortening options you consider acceptable in parentheses next to the word 'shortening' in the recipes.
That's not correct in my experience. I have several bottles of preserved chillies in oil in the fridge, and a jar of olive oil infused with garlic and herbs I use in salad dressings, and in all cases the oil is solidified! I always take my salad dressing oil out of the fridge for some time before using to allow it to liquify!
Further, oil content notwithstanding, with this recipe my dough was so firm when I took it out of the fridge that it was difficult to work until it warmed through hand-kneading - actually, it was so hard after its time in the fridge that it was difficult even to get it out of the bowl initially! And as mentioned above, the end result was excellent! Perhaps I used just enough butter to save the day: reviewing my notes, I used 135gm butter and 205gm oil.
This is not the first recipe I've tested in which my findings were that the ingredients were out. That's not a criticism as such. It's just that I thought one of the points of this testing project was to fine-tune the recipes and modify those in which one or more ingredients were other than optimal in quantity? With respect, if they all worked "great" as is, why would there be any need for testing?
Cheers
Ross
And stick just to the facts
in this case you have changed the molecular structur of the oil with the additions of chillies and herbs, which containe diferent oils of their own, this can cause veg oil to jel at cold temps not become solid. plain olive oil also will jel. However most regular cooking oil such as canola, corn, and regular veg or general purpose oil will not
shortening refers to any fat that is solid at room temp about 75 F wihich oil is not.
Also from what i read you used more oil than butter. to me thats not topping off to my understanding of the meaning and will make major changes to the formula. (forming a sticky paste rather than a dough).
lasty the hard condition and the fact it needed to be kneaded is normal for this dough (and this dough is in the family of sweet short pastry) is absoluty normal and was in the instructions. Keading while cold is called breaking the dough and will cause a very slight gluten devolpment which is nessacery to make the dough able to be rolled out with out breaking
i hope this clears up any misunderanding and thanks for helping us test the formulas.
Norm,
I mean this truly as a friendly suggestion... you may not want to include scientific statements in your book without having a qualified scientist thoroughly review them.
Best of luck with your new book.
SteveB
www.breadcetera.com
I too have found that oils (specifically olive oil) that are liquid at 40ºF when pure become solid at that temperature when mixed with an acidic substance, in my case vinegar. There is usually salt, pepper and herbs, mustard and other stuff in the mix, too. The scientific name for this compound is "salad dressing."
As one of our "qualified scientist" members - a biochemist, as I recall - can you offer a corrected explanation for Norm's?
David
David, I didn't realize I passed the qualifying exam! :>)
My comment was merely meant to draw attention to the fact that mixing two substances together, and thereby causing a change in a physical property (e.g. adding salt to ice to lower the ice's melting point... the scientific name for this is "salting your driveway"), isn't necessarily the result of changing either of the substances' molecular structures. One can affect intermolecular interactions, and thus certain physical properties, without changing molecular structure.
If Norm can tell us how an oil's molecular structure is changed by adding herbs, I'm all ears...
SteveB
www.breadcetera.com
when I put my oil, vinegar and herbs in a blender it becomes creamy..I always refered to it as 'emulsified'. Would this be correct?
Sylvia
David, I am a biochemist, although I have to say that the word "biochemist" conveys a huge HUGE world of stuff - being a biochemist does not make a person an expert in fatty acids, for instance.
However, when you mix an oil with things like vinegar, mustard, herbs - you are not solidifying the oil in the sense of changing its chemical basic structure, you are only making an emulsion, "suspending" the oil into a hydrophilic (aqueous) environment.
I agree, though - to include scientific statements in any cookbook, it is better to consult a biochemist, and in this case an EXPERT in lipids, which is quite a complex field of research
The issue, though, is the state change that occurs in salad dressing when it's chilled. Time to search.
David
but I do like humor when all is said and done : )
Sylvia
No, that was not the issue I raised. I'm still waiting for Norm to explain how an oil's molecular structure is changed by adding herbs, as he stated in his post.
SteveB
www.breadcetera.com
David, my salad oil is not a dressing as such. It is just extra virgin olive oil infused with cut garlic cloves and sometimes - but not always - herbs. There is no vinegar. I add vinegar only when I make my dressings, which I do just before serving salad. I never store dressings - only the garlic infused oil. I find dressings taste better assembled fresh with herbs plucked straight from the garden.
Scientific explanations aside, here's a simple experiment that will clear up any doubts over whether olive oil does or does not solidify at fridge temperatures (not addressing you personally...just writing in the context of this discussion): store some olive oil in a jar by itself in the fridge for 24 hours then have a look at it. In this case, you don't need scientific expertise to assess the facts - all you need is your eyes!
Yes, quite correct: I used the term "topping up" erroneously, before I had checked my notes. I did indeed use much more oil than butter, but it is not correct that this resulted in a 'sticky paste rather than a dough'. It was never sticky - just oily! And with the addition of an extra 105gm of flour, it was certainly a dough!
Yes - and this is my point! The dough and the biscuits worked out fine - and behaved 'normally' as you put it, using 2/3rd oil! I'm not being deliberately awkward here - just relating the facts as I noted them. Theory is one thing; practice another.
I should add that I am simply stating my truth as it relates to this recipe, not defending my use of oil. I have noted and accept your point that it does not qualify as 'shortening'. Now that I know that, I will not be making such a substitution again.
for the Linzer Cookies either in the recipe or as a tip. It is very educational.
I let my dough sit out for a half hour before rolling, I cut the kneading short thinking it was only to warm up the dough a bit. Had I known, I might not have squished up the dough half way thru the first roll because the dough was ripping/tearing (but that is really nothing new and now I know why, Thank you!) It stuck to itself nicely when I overlapped the rips to mend and when I set two ripped cookie pieces together they baked out beautifully. Yes, I would have preferred cold with a little more gluten. Instead of warmer dough with less. That is my fault but the info would have been useful. I did use more flour than my average for rolling out the dough, which was AP.
I still love the dough and the mouth feel and taste is in high demand. The cookies made it to a prominant coffee circle. I have been asked several times already for the recipe. Which I am safely guarding. A plate of cookies also went to my neighbor when I asked to borrow him & his tractor, absolutely no problem! The next day the plate was returned with a smile. So now I'm working on my garden steps as soon as it stops raining.
Mini
that this will be in the book and i am sorry if it was left out of the instructions. the dough for linz as well as any type of cutout or shortbread cookie (buscut) in the sweet short pastry family should be handled the same
keep the dough as cold as possible but placing the dough back into the mixer for a minute or two after an over night chill will do to things
one.. will re work the fats to a plastic consistency ( they don't break or crumble like a very hard fat) like modeling clay
two will develop a very small amount of gluten which makes the dough abale to be rolled with out the dough tearing or crumbeling.
also note that the dough shoule only be mixed once. then fresh dough should be placed in the mixer along with the scrap dough left over from cuting out the cookies and mixed together.
in any event the dough should (idealy) not be rolled out more than two times without some fresh dough added. after the second roll you will see the dough start to change color and get dry and break in to pieces when rolled (third time the dough gets old and overworked) making a tough cookie (due to the devolpment of to much glutin and the absorbtion of all that extra flour used to keep the dough from sticking when rolling)
ps: being you are only 5 Km from linz i greatfully accept your coments as one of the greatest i have every received... my feet have still not come down to the floor :)
without adding fresh dough and the last two ugly shaped lumps of dough still had a good mouth feel. I ate them first while I was testing my jam. This is the stuff that impresses me. I did not go to the coffee with the cookies. The requests came over the telephone! So stay floating!
I let one Chinese Cookie get hard. I stuck it in the cake box with the last of Sylvia's pound cake for about 6 hours and last night I ate it, soft and tasty with a glass of milk before bed. Another good point. Keep floating!
Now I'm onto another familiar recipe. These salty bread sticks also get stuffed with garlic in these parts and stretched out to a foot long! They are then topped with a mixture of caraway and flax seed. I will stick to the recipe. (For most of them.)
Mini
I should have measured how much extra flour I had to add, but I did not. At that point I was in full desperation mode, trying to make the dough turn into something that could be rolled out
I used shortening, measured everything very carefully with the scale, except for the egg, which I used large, without weighing. I doubt that would be the problem, though
Thems look delicious!!!
David
I wound them really tight to see how much they would expand. They tripled proofing and boiling, and still doubled with oven spring.
David G
These are lovely, if I ever get around to making bagels these will be my first shape to make..lovely...and I love the really big ones in the photo sent in above, nice work.
Sylvia
Does your comment mean you've never made bagels, or just not recently? If the answers never, I'm amazed. I thought there's nothing you haven't baked, and baked well!
David G
and my husband used eat them all the time. To many carbs and just not a bagel fan; I guess is my best excuse. I do like the look of the twisted ones. When I have eaten bagels I like the ones with dried fruit in them or plain and toasted.
Sylvia
the recipe arrived on Wednesday evening for me
maybe you should double check with Stan, because I think you are supposed to be baking those before Monday
Cake Crumbs
Sorry folks I have been busy with this book. Bakers do not waste anything. If you want to be real bakers that is the first rule to learn (well it was the first thing i learned and it was a painfull lesson as i felt the slap of a german hand on my head as i put a few used pieces of parchment in the trash).
Anything that does not get sold goes into the crumb bin. Left over cinnamon buns, leftover Danish. Left over doughnuts, croissants and of course left over cake is used for crumbs. In fact anything that does not have heavy icing (the white icing on buns is ok) such as butter creams, cheese fillings, fruit fillings, and jellies and jams are used for crumbs.
Most of you bake many things other than cake so it is time to stop tossing these stale items out. Just leave them out at room temp exposed to air, not in plastic wrap or anything, just leave them out in a big bowl (that way they will not mold)
When they are completely dry grind them up into crumbs when ground use a course sifter get out any pieces that did not grind and as long as they are completely dry they will hold for 90 days and longer.
i am sure you will accumulate quite a lot of crumbs very soon.
Baker's use these crumbs as a way to prevent loss of money and time. In addition, in some formulas they add texture and a great flavor.
If you end up with too many crumbs, there will be formulas in the book for nut cake and spice cake. Should you make to much spice and nut cakes guess what! The stale cake made with crumbs GOES RIGHT BACK INTO THE CRUMB BIN TO MAKE MORE CRUMBS. So stop feeding the garbage and start feeding the crumb bin.
That is all for now
Time for back to work (bad movie reference) Tor Johnson (the super sweedish angel)
Time for go to bed now
So surprised to find that reference! Now if you mention MST3K and Joel I'll faint.
:-Paul
was great but so was mike
We felt that Joel had so much more humility as the host, he was able to stand back and let the 'bots have the show, be their straight man even, whereas Mike always seemed to hog the camera, he didn't seem able to really step back, at least not as the host - he was always mugging. When he was a guest character while Joel was the host he did do some great stuff. Different strokes for different folks I guess. Anyway, what a great show it was. We have all the Joel tapes (even back to KTMA) and often watch them while drifting off to dreamland. Gamera, etc.
this is way off for this thread and i agree theshow was great with both of them and joel (the one who thought the whole thing up in the first place) was the better of the two but i did love them both mike was the best in the special parts
torgo's pizza (its still hot!!!)
i have seen and know of only one surviving KTMA fan tape if you have more i would gladly pay for a copy ( it more customary to trade in true MST3K tradishion (sp) but i don't have much other than other digital downloads.
Gamera...
Gamera
gamera is realy neet gamera is full of meat i"m in love with Gammmmmerrrrrrraaaaaaaaa
I'd be happy to make you a copy of the KTMA season. I sent you a message to get this posting off the discussionn of your book and recipes.
:-Paul
For the second week's recipe I made Onion Pockets. They were terrific and I will certainly be making them again. I was a bit careless in the shaping and cutting of the pockets and so had quite a wide range of sizes. My tasters (I shanghai my family) and I each had one hot out of the oven (Stan & Norm: sorry we could not wait the 30 minutes). For lunch this week I used one to make a great sandwich. The flavor was great, soft crust and a the texture of the crumb was great.
Here is half the batch:
I look forward to making the next recipe, which for me are the Montreal Bagels. I've had some problems with bagels in the past which I hope I can correct.
Happy Baking!
Dwayne
Filled fruit buns - look a lot like the ones posted above, phew! and I believe the expression is 'crashed and burned' on the Wonder Cake. Stan has sent me nice email about the Wonder Cake, so I am carrying on regardless with my British flours and my hand mixer. Any one else do this one? It's vey challenging, the idea I guess, doing these without a picture, so it's lovely to see your pics here, I wish I had thought to come and look right away!
don't waste it. cut it into small pieces and let it get dry , grind it up for cake crumbs for cinnamon buns danish or some of the testing formulas.
When is this book coming out? I would really like to buy a copy. Patsy
I don't think we will make the holiday season so we are looking to make it to Q1 of next year
It was delicate, it was buttery, it was good. And now it is (almost) gone.
Still warm from the oven.
I considered scoring the loaf, but the instructions didn't call for scoring. As expected, it split. I like the rustic look. I like to let rye breads rest for at least 24 hours before I cut them, so I'll post a crumb shot tomorrow.
David G.
That is one FANTASTIC looking loaf. When are they going to get the smell-a-vision working!?
I'm impressed with how round it is. The Greenstein recipe tends to produce rather flat loaves. I hope you post a crumb shot and tasting notes.
The bursting testifies to the oven spring you got. I'm making mine today. I may try docking the loaf.
David
It seems I learn new things all the time here. I am finally getting back to reading these older threads (barley bread dough is rising now) and you said you may try "docking" the loaf. This semi-newbie would appreciate it. Edited to say: Could you explain this technique to me? (I guess I thought you could read my mind...)
Thanks!
Trish =)
Hi, Trish.
Docking is the term used for poking holes in the top of a loaf before baking. This is to "let off steam," as far as I know. It is an alternative to scoring to keep a loaf from bursting. AFAIK, docking of this sort is only done with rye breads.
See Corn Rye (Kornbroyt) reprise in this topic for an example and Hansjoakim's Favorite 70% Sourdough Rye for another.
In commercial bakeries, this is done with a tool - a roller with teeth sticking out. I use a chopstick.
Hope this answers your question.
David
Thank you David!
T
Crust: thick, very chewy
Crumb:dense but not heavy, chewy!
Flavor: Rye and Caraway--I cut back on the caraway by 1/3; glad I did, it's present but not dominating. This is rye bread at its best.
Toasted, for breakfast, with a dab of butter. Had to have seconds.
David G
It is delicious, indeed. I had some toasted this morning too.
I'm thinking of making another this weekend for a rye-loving friend.
David
I love the transliteration of this bread's name from the Yiddish! That's the way my grandfathers talked. Words we would pronounce with a long "O" or sometimes "AU" sound, the Eastern European Yiddish speakers pronounced "Oy." "Torah" was pronounced "Toyrah" (with a slight, soft guttural "r," too.)
It's a near dead language - Yiddish.
But Corn Rye lives on! Whatever you call it.
I didn't get as much bursting as DavidG. Having the benefit of seeing his bread, I let mine proof longer than I would have otherwise. I got one minor burst on the top and a couple larger ones at the junction of the sides and bottom of the loaf.
I haven't sliced this yet. I might wait until tomorrow to slice it, but I will keep smelling it!
Added: I was weak. I only lasted 6 hours.
Corn Rye profile, cut.
Corn Rye crumb
The crust is thick and very chewy. This is a dense, heavy bread. For a rye lover, it's a classic. I've never had a corn rye this good. It is moderately sour with a strong presence of both rye and caraway flavors. The crumb is also quite chewy, even though there is no perceptible gluten development.
Oh, my! Not a pastrami in sight! (Actually, it's wonderful, just plain.)
David
David
for a real taste of home (at least for me -- and healthy diet be damned) try it with a schmear of rendered chicken fat and a little salt, or the way my grandmother used to eat it -- lightly rubbed with a cut clove of garlic!
Stan
I've never seen a chemical analysis of schmaltz. It's liquid at room temperature. This means it probably doesn't have a lot of saturated fats. Who knows? It might be as good for you as olive oil.
Calories? Who's counting?
Anyway, garlic is well known to be an essential nutrient. I'm sure it counteracts anything harmful in anything.
David
Or, you could roast the garlic until soft, then blend it with the schmaltz, and make a Jewish garlic butter. We functionally do this by braising a whole chicken with 40 cloves of garlic in a paella pan, then taking the rendered fat and pan juices and roasted garlic cloves and smearing it on bread. It's delish.
I hope I remember to do that next time I roast a chicken.
I never knew my paternal grandmother, and I don't know much about her cooking. The one thing my father told me about it (frequently) was how she made roast chicken. She made a paste of schmaltz, salt and crushed garlic and coated the chicken with the paste before roasting it. The drippings must have been wonderful!
David
I often spatchcock (butterfly) our chicken before roasting flat on a rimmed baking sheet. I cut out the backbone using kitchen shears, flip the bird over, break the breastbone by pushing down on it, then run my fingers under the skin to loosen it. Then I put a mix of minced garlic, salt, pepper and olive oil under the skin, on the breasts and thighs, and then lightly oil and salt and pepper the top of the skin. Roast in a 425 degree oven till done (about 35-40 minutes for the birds I normally get).
The rendered drippings are amazing as a dip for crusty bread (and as a subsequent base for chicken and vegetable soup or chili), and the chicken is flavorful, succulent, and tender. And don't even get me started on the skin.
I think I would have liked your grandma's cooking, especially if she made Babka. It's my new favorite.
FYI
Proportions of fatty acids as percentage of total fatty-acid content
Fat or Oil
Saturated Fatty Acids
Monounsaturated Fatty Acids
Polyunsaturated Fatty acids*
Butter
62
29
4
Margarine (stick)
19
59
18
Chicken
30
45
21
Beef
50
42
4
Vegetable shortening
31
51
14
Corn
13
24
59
Olive
13
74
8
Canola
7
55
33
Safflower
9
12
75
Coconut oil
86
6
2
Cocoa butter
60
35
2
* Note that those terrible trans-fats re included. (Chemically, they are polyunsaturated.)
McGee, Harold, On Food and Cooking: The Science and Lore of The Kitchen, Scribner, NY, 2004, pg. 800.
Among animal fats, chicken fat is lowest in cholesterol - 77 mgms/100gms. Clarified butter is 200 mgms/100 gms.
Source: http://www.fatfreekitchen.com/cholesterol/cholesterol-oils.html
Note: All data are without garlic.
David
And now you know why they didn't eat too much coconut in the Ukraine.
David
My troupe of virgins have been helping me out. (I'm keeping them busy.) The green ones are Dragon eyes and my own idea with pumpkin seed. I got happy tasters (lab rats.)
I haven't had one of those in years! I used to love them.
I don't see the "green ones."
David
I rolled them in chopped pumpkin seeds, the two go well together, almonds and pumpkin seed. After the honeymoon, I was afraid to overdue the rolling in the seeds. These were the first to vanish. If the almonds are "eyes" then these look like dragon eyes to me.
Those Ryes turned out fantastic! I can't wait! And that walnut roll... fruit rolls... oh my!
Mini
Sometimes, a cookie is just a cookie.
The Corn Rye is delicious. I had some for lunch - a kosher salami sandwich with garlicky pickles and Vernor's ginger ale. (It's a combo from my ancestral village, Detroit.)
David
The best ginger ale in the entire US of A! Haven't seen any of that here in the RSA. There are, however, some pretty decent ginger beers available.
Still, Vernor's. The gingery burn in the throat, the tingly tickle in the nose... Float a scoop of vanilla ice cream on top and it just doesn't get much better. One of the few things in Michigan that still works as good as it used to.
The last couple of times I've been home, I've seen Stroh's ice cream. Any connection to the Strohs of brewing fame?
Paul
Oh, Paul. I haven't done that for so long! My father's preference was chocolate ice cream. Excellent!
Vernor's has been available in California from a plant in Gardena (LA area) for quite a while. Before that (1960's), my uncle, who had moved to CA to attend Stanford Law School and stayed in San Francisco, would bring back gallon jugs of Vernor's syrup when he went back to Detroit.
David
Another HUGE fan of Vernor's here! My husband is from Michigan and introduced me to Vernor's 12 years ago (we do have then here in Oklahoma)
it you guys ever go to Brazil, try a soda called "Guarana' " it is similar, although slightly more sweet, but very delicious too.
Vernor's is amazing, at first I thought all ginger ales would be the same, so I bought one of those "generic" kinds: huge disappointment. I am surprised they are allowed to call it by that name!
You're right on about Vernor's still going strong (and cherished) here in the rust belt of Michigan, Paul.
And yes, Stroh's Ice Cream was part of the Stroh's Brewery - fab with Vernor's poured over it!
Better Maid is still in business and producing great chips. I recall going to their plant to buy a large bag of their "overdone" lovely brown, caramelized chips for all of twenty-five cents. Now they're selling them for about three bucks.
Really enjoyed these. Easy, relatively quick and delicious. And sub-lethal butter content, for a change!
Very tasty and turned out great. This is my first successful rye bread from sourdough starter.
I can't wait for the book to be complete. I see so many things I want to try- the twisted bagels, challah loaf, walnut rolls & onion pockets all look great.- ok actually everything looks fantastic! Very exciting!
Margie
Should the dough be fermented/proofed to the point it bursts less, or is the bursting expected and desirable?
Do you ever dock corn rye?
David
In an oven with steam injection ( yes i know not many people have a boiler or steam injector on their oven) there is enough steam to keep the bursting it a minimum. my corn rye would open at the bottom as your picture shows but the crust on top would hold. In a home oven docking the bread a few times with a stick (like a chopstick) should help. using as much steam as you can make will help also.
or perhaps one of thouse clay cover thingys
Best guess since i have never used one.
as for fremanted
the dough is mixed alowed to rise then shaped and put right into the oven. it must be shaped gently as so not beat the h**l out of it and keep as much gas as posable in the bread. since it goes right into the oven with out any proof if you knock it flat or lose to much gas the crust might crack because of oven spring. if you can keep as much gas as you can their will be less spring and then less cracking.
ether way if it tastes great to you and like it thats whats important
Ps ( since this bread can be used as a boat anchor it was sold by the pound so most people never saw a whole loaf so we would hide the cracks by cutting the bread along the crack lines)
what the eye does not see the chef can getaway with ;)
Next time, I believe I'll try docking the loaf (I do use a chopstick) and baking under a stainless steel bowl until the oven is turned down.
I rounded up the loaf best I could as I transferred it from the mixing bowl to the container for fermenting. I was very gentle in final shaping, as instructed. However, I would think de-gassing the dough would decrease oven spring. (There are fewer bubbles to expand.) What am I missing?
David
it is strange but i have seen and experenced over proofed rye fall almost flat when picked up and put on a peel.
however when put into the oven with lots and lots of steam it springs back to full size and has a good crumb and crust.
it could be because rye is very yeast friendly. other breads will just fall but rye has an amazing recovery ability. why i dont know but i have seen it many times.
This is my 3rd week's recipe. I was very peased with the way they turned out and looked. I've never made bagels that looked this good before.
Dwayne
Those put any bagels available out here to shame. As do David's.
I am so looking forward to testing a bagel recipe. Us west coasters don't really have access to good ones....
I love the color you got - both how dark they are and the evenness of the color. Any comments on chewiness and flavor?
David
Thanks David! I tried to follow the instructions very carefully as I have had problems with making bagels in the past (they looked a bit shriveled). The color is partly due to the Malt Syrup in the boiling water and then baking. I used a baking stone. The may be a bit over done, but the color was nice.
These were not all that chewy as I used bread flour instead of High Gluten flour. The crumb was not dense, really fairly light. Again this was probably due to the flour or it could be due to these not having any salt in the dough. What type of flour did you use on your twisted bagels? They really looked nice.
Dwayne
I used KAF Sir Lancelot. The bagels were very chewy. High gluten flour makes the best bagels ... when they are fresh. They do not freeze and reheat well, I'm sorry to discover.
David
How is it possible that I am the first one to post on this recipe? It was a slam-dunk hit, even with my very good at baking, very particular in her tastes friend. The look on her face as she took her first bite and said "Oh, my!" was the best baking praise I've ever earned,
I'm definitely keeping this recipe. I'm going to make it for our family reunion this summer and blow everyone away. It's that good. Thanks, Norm and Stan!
In these photos the crust looks burned, but it's not. The loaves are dark brown, as per the instructions, but no black. It's tasty!
Hi folks,
I've been lurking and learning from all of you for quite a while. It's time to post a picture.
Betsy
To all of you for testing.
I just wanted to take a minute to thank all of you for taking the time and materials to test these formulas.
What we are doing is looking at all (and we do look at all of them) these feadback forms that were sent in to check our math (remember some of these formulas started with as much as 36 pounds of sugar) and to adjust the formulas for the home baker.
Because of the great feadback we have adjusted some of the formulas and corrected some math mistakes that happened as the formulas were reduced to make them more practable for the average home kitchen.
Your help will make this book something special Thank you all.
An interesting recipe.
I would be honored!
Let me know if I need to send some kind of release or something