Hello all,
I am trying to use this enforced home time to get a sourdough starter going. I read an article that said using dried fruit in the initial mix would help boost the yeast present in the starter, so I decided to try it. I thought it was going well, but I'm noticing some weirdness, and I'm not sure if it's normal, or if I need to start over, and could use some advice.
I'm using a quart mason jar, less than a quarter full of my starter attempt, I wanted to make sure it had room. Everything is well mixed, and I place a paper towel over the top, secured with the ring, so that it can still breath, but won't get any contaminants. Each morning when I go to pull some and refresh/feed it, it looks odd. There is a layer of sediment at the bottom, like unconsumed flour, then a layer of clear liquid, which I assume is the water I add in, then a thick layer on top of the starter, complete with small bubble pockets in it.
It's this layer on top I'm not sure about, as each day, it seems thicker, and more like rubber as it has formed overnight. Am I doing something wrong, or right? Do I need to save just the thick layer on top to feed into the next starter? Should I be stirring it all up into a soup again before pulling some to feed for the next stage of the starter? Is this screwy, and I just need to start over from scratch?
If it makes any difference, I'm currently using a mix of King Arthur's Whole Wheat All-Purpose and Bread flours for this sourdough starter attempt.
Thanks in advance for any tips, and/or advice. I love sourdough, but have never successfully started my own starter from scratch.
Baking_Dad
Is that thick layer but not 100% sure as I can’t see it. Right now I suggest taking a break from feeding and just stirring it until the whole thing is active. Don’t worry if it start stinking for a bit as it’s the bacterias battling it out. By the way, the good ones will win once the mixture gets acidic enough. When you see lots of bubbles through the whole thing, start discarding and feeding. And you don’t need to make huge amounts either. You can easily build up to a baking amount from small bit of starter.
I have heard of getting wild yeast into your starter by using fruit, but I had not heard to use dried fruit. How did you incorporate it? I started a starter by using fruit once, but it was fresh fruit. I used local grapes. I put them, unwashed, in a gallon ziplock bag with a couple of cups of flour. Then, I gently rolled the bag over & over, in my hands, to coat the grapes & move the flour around. I put the bag in the fridge & took it out long enough to roll it around a bit & put it back in the fridge, for a few days. After which, I took the bag out of the fridge, removed the grape cluster, shaking off the flour as best I could, while keeping the flour in the bag. I used that flour to make my starter. It was a fun project & turned out great! Starting a new starter always feels so dicey, for the first several days.
Fun fact: my starter smelled like our local wineries during harvest/mash season, for at least three months.
On the dried fruit, I read an article that was a collected from the tweets of a geneticist, specializing in yeasts. He had tweeted in response to cries of people hoarding yeast, fearing they would run out. He said to use dried fruit, like raisins or apricots. Add them to the water of your starter, and swirl it around. He stated the cloudiness you see coming off of the fruit is the yeast that was on it. Then add your flour and proceed as normal. I added it all in on the first day, and at the feeding on the second day, scooped out just starter, discarding the fruit.
That sounds awesome! I might have to give that one a try, myself. Thanks!
Just an update, I think the starter is going fine, I'm just not understanding why it is separating like that. I add equal parts water and flour. I paid more attention to it throughout the day after yesterday's feeding. Within three hours, I had the separation again. However, the bubbly layer on top grew to almost three times it level in the jar. Overnight, it has sunk down some, and I'm wondering if the rubberiness(if that's a word) is just coming from the starter sinking back on itself and condensing?
When I feed today, I'm going to take from just the top starter layer, and not stir it back up into a single layer again, and see how that goes.
Really excited because I think I might have my first, viable, made from scratch starter going on!
By volume, or by weight?
If volume, then the mixture is prone to separating as you have described. Use less water and more flour to thicken the mixture to at least a batter consistency, if not thicker.
If by weight, then I really don't know what's going on. Suggest less water and more flour in the mix to give it a thicker texture.
Paul
I am doing by volume, and aiming for a thick batter consistency.
Further clarification, rubbery probably isn't the best description of the top layer. It's more like it has formed a thick, gloopy dough, that doesn't pull apart easily. When I scooped some into the new jar this morning, almost the whole top layer comes out in as single mass. It readily loosens up with the addition of water and a little stirring.
However, I add a little more flour, and stir it into a thick batter consistency, and within a couple of hours, it has separated again. The top layer is still percolating away, but it is, once again very thick.
The only real experience I've had with sourdough starters is those gifted from others. Those starters were thinner, more like the batter consistency, where as mine, while it starts out like batter when I feed it, thickens up to a wet dough consistency. Just not sure if I'm doing something wrong, or if this is fairly normal, and as long as I have activity on the top layer, I should be good?
And what you describe sounds right.
So yesterday, after I fed the new starter, and it once again did it separation trick, and then the top layer did it's double in size bit, I decided to try something new. It had been about 8 hours since I fed it in the morning, and I decided to try and stir the layers back together, and see if it continued percolating. Horror of Horrors! It separated again, but now into just two layers, starter, and liquid, but the liquid was on top! I have to admit that I was thinking that I'd just killed this thing I'd been working on for days, and was ready to toss in the towel.
However, I decided to see if it was ok, and this morning, as the liquid layer was on top, I was able to pour most of it off, transfer starter to a new jar, add water, stir, then add flour and stir into a batter consistency. Wonder of wonders, within a few hours, it had separated back into it's traditional 3 layers, and the top layer was percolating away and growing nicely.
I'm pretty excited about the fact that this seems to be working, even if it is a little weird. I'm anxious to start using it to make loaves of bread and pancakes. How long should I keep feeding it before I can start to use it? I know the flavor will change and mature over time, but as long as I retain enough to continue the starter, can I go ahead and start using it? By the way, I started it this past weekend, so it's been five or six days now.
Also, I'm doing the volume measurements because I don't have a functioning digital scale. I'd bought one when starting artisanal breads, because I was assured that precise measurements made for better bread. However, my bread never turned out well following precise measurements in the recipes. I always ended up having to adjust until it looked or felt right to get a decent loaf out of it. So the scale languished in disuse, until the batteries corroded and killed it....
Thanks for all the advice!
It doesn’t have to be exact but you need to thicken things up.
Tap water in some cities can be a problem.
If you're using municpal tap water, is your water known for having noticeable chlorine? If so, let the water sit out, covered with a paper towel, over night, to evaporate off the chlorine. Or, use bottled _spring_ water, which is better than filtered water. Bottled _spring_ water is better than bottled "purified" water, too.
Does your house have, what is called in the U.S., a "water conditioner"? That can mess things up too.
So I fed the starter yesterday, and like normal, it separated, a little flour on the bottom, a layer of water, and then the starter bubbling away on top. However, this time, overnight, it flipped, and this morning, all of the starter was on the bottom, with a layer of liquid on top. Not sure what happened, but it still looks ok.
So I'm dying to make sourdough pancakes, so when I fed it today, I took the leftovers, about half a cup, and added it to milk and flour, with a little brown sugar, from a recipe I found on this forum, and will let it sit overnight, and hope to make pancakes in the morning.
When I fed the starter this time, I used more flour than water, and stirred it into a very thick batter. We'll see if that helps with the separation weirdness.
Oh, and BTW, I am using tap water, but I'm out in a rural area, no high chlorine, and I don't have a water softener.
I think your starter is still too liquid, and the flour you are introducing doesn't have enough gluten to keep all this water bonded. Try making your next feed more (much more) rubbery and mix more religiously ))))
So I reduced the water, and am using a mix of flours, including higher protein bread flour. The most immediate thing I am noticing it that it is taking a long time to get happy and bubbling again.
When I was using, what I assume, was a to thin mixture for the starter, it would separate and begin bubbling madly away within a couple of hours, and within a couple fo that, the starter layer on top of the liquid would easily double, if not more.
Now, with a thicker starter mix, it is taking a lot longer, and I mean 20 or more hours to double in volume. Is this normal, or is it because I've only really been working on this starter for a week, and it's not really mature yet?
Any advice is appreciated.