Best Way to Achieve Holes - Open Crumb Structure

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Harleyellen05 on 3 Nov 2017 at 08:37

If you are routinely successful in achieving a crumb with well distribute, good sized holes, I am interested in hearing your methodology. In the past, I  have explored this topic from the negative, as in "what am I doing wrong." Responses are easily confusing so I thought to approach this in another way. I realize I'm asking for a time consuming response but I thought it worth a try. Thanks in advance for the help. 

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kendalm on 3 Nov 2017 at 09:39

There have been a lot of open crumb questions recently. I dont think there is one correct way to achieve an open crumb especially since there are so many bread types, flour types etc but there are some things i have noticed that might help. First off gluten needs to be well developed so you want to be confident that you are kneading just right - not over doing it nor under doing it. If you are making ciabatta for example, generally a strong flour with a lot of water amd little kneading. Lower the dough hydration or lower the protein and that means more attention to the mechanical development of nice elastic dough. Second is yeast and making sure activity isnt too high. The less gas in you dough the more opportunity to inflate a fewer bubbles to a large size. A highly yeasted dough thats pushing in co2 rapidly can lead to sandwich style crumb. Third is final proofong and making sure that especially overproofing is avoided as that means the gluten cant support the structure you want and as mentioned recently in a another post, this can haplen in the blinknof an eye. Finally, a nice hot oven with steam - this is helpful in getting maximized spring. If everything else is done right a slow bake wont provide enough energy to inflate the gas quickly enough. Even though these are just pointers the best thing is just lots of repetition with adjustments and eventually it just sort of happens as everyones ingredients and equipment differs. I would recommend sticking to one recipe and perfectimg it as opposed to swapping it up every other time since as mentioned, many steps contribute to the structure. Maybe you can post the details of your efforts as that can help members here identify where to focus. There are some posts here on occassion asking whats the big deal of there are holes. Some think it makesbfor a betterbeating experience and think itsbabway to demonstrate control over the process. Personaly I thinkbit a bit of both and its important to remember that gold bread made at home holes or no holes is more enjoyable than just about any store bought loaf. Good luck !

Thank you for your detailed response. You've given me numerous things to try. I've got a system for plenty of steam. The journey continues....

high hydration dough.  I've been doing sour dough bread baking for only 2 1/2 years and I don't touch high hydration doughs.  I prefer Trevor Wilson's advice and method.  Look him up on you tube and specifically the video on getting large holes with a 65% hydration.  I might try 68 - 70% in a few months but not yet.  Lol.'

good luck

Is a good way to start a 'holes' endeavor. The water helps gluten and theres little shaping distractions as ciabatta is just a blob. Another thing would be to go with smaller loaves the move up to larger ones. The smaller the better for heat transfer. Ok weekend is here - time to get busy !

I watched Trevor Wilson's video on Champlain Bread. Fascinating technique. Something to try that makes it possible to add starter at peak development.

Thanks everyone for all the good advice and shared experience.  Yesterday, I made Trevor's, "Champlain Bread." Even though I baked it on a stone in my electric oven that is lined w 6 firebricks - 3 each side, instead of a cast iron pot, it was the best artisan loaf that I have ever baked. It tasted darn good as well, although I tend to like a bit more whole grain flavor. Once I can repeat this success, I may try increasing the proportion of spelt and rye or just try one of his other formulas. Now if I could just figure out how to edit the photos I took so they will fit into my post.

 

sandwich bread, I do strive for it on my baguettes and on any "dipping" bread.  I have had my most consistent success with following the same basic approach as hreik has already mentioned: the techniques and approach shown by Trevor Wilson: http://www.breadwerx.com/ and sticking with mostly lower hydration (75% or less) dough. 

As kendalm mentioned, having a super hot oven with the right amount of steam is definitely beneficial, and placement of steaming device matters, too (one loaf directly over the steam - which cools the baking surface somewhat - will have notably less rise and a less open crumb than another loaf on a hotter part of the baking surface).

For a more highly detailed response, it is the entire overall process that all needs to work together for me, and is written out in a couple of responses on this thread from a while back:  http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/52819/scoring-obtaining-proper-surface

When it comes to higher hydration dough, I find it critical to fully develop the gluten when the levain hits the dough, and then use the fridge to tighten things up so that shaping and scoring are easier and can be done more "gently".

It really is a matter of figuring out what works best with your ingredients and your tools and your skills and your preferences - and is largely a matter of trial and error.  Fortunately, even the "errors" taste fantastic, so it is a wonderfully delicious learning curve!

The most important thing is to be happy while baking - as your enjoyment of the activity will make even the tricksy bits seem easier and more fun.

Looking forward to seeing your bakes!

Harleyellen05,

The most important thing is to be happy while baking - as your enjoyment of the activity will make even the tricksy bits seem easier and more fun.

IceDementer is spot on with the above  portion of his post.  The demands we place on ourselves striving for what we would like to have is sometimes daunting.  We gotta remember to enjoy the journey.  Even if it seems a struggle.

My high hydration doughs such as Ciabatta or Focaccia are the easiest for open crumb.  This is only because of very gentle handling.  Limited stretch and folds, carful forming, flipping upside down on the baking sheet, and a hot oven with steam.

The batards or baguettes are a different story.  Hydrations run around 72% ~ 75%.  Limited mixing/kneading and long bulk times of up to three hours or more.  With a couple of stretch/folds divided in the time.  

I've found that these doughs respond best after the bulk being gently divided and a 30 to 40 minute rest.  Then again very gently shaping.... Do not squish out all the softness and puffiness, but form by 'tensioning' the dough's surface for good oven spring.  

The 'Proof' time is very elusive, for me at least.  Too short and split sides, too long and limited spring. Again, hot oven, first 10 to 12 minutes steam twice, then drop temp slightly and bake until good color.  Shut the oven off and open the door slightly for an additional 25 minutes to set the crust.  All this will have to be adjusted to your environment and oven performance.

Baking is an art or what I think of as a dance... the recipes only give you a starting point.  Again, have fun and enjoy your successes and almost successes.  They all taste good and I still have both.  It will get easier......

French Batard.... (slightly under proofed, but good)

Thats huge improvenent. One thing i want to point out on your comments with baguettes and batards - if youve gotten the yeast activity under control and so long as your dough has a decent gluten structure you dont have to worry about such gentle handling. You may notice many of the pro videos, they degas rather aggressively. There's really no need to try and preserve the bigger gas pockets (unless of course you want really randomized stucture with the occassional massive bubble). If the gasses are present and proof is on, you will be surprised by the power of the oven in inflating even the smallest gas bubbles. I will usually do the opposite of gentle handling and intentionally remove as much larger bubvles as possible until the dough is quite flat and devoid of puffyness - that tends to get a nice uniform open crumb, otherwise being too gentle results in unwanted large cavities. They important thing is to keep the yeast activity on the low end then infuse as much energy (in the form of heat) to raise fewer gas pockets to their maximum size and btw that should all happen within about 5 minutes of hitting the hot stone - the rest of the bake browning and hardening. If it takes 10-12 minites plus 25 then you might consider bumping the temperature - again 5 minutes of intense heat to raise, another 5 to being the setting of the shape then 10 (maaaaaybe 15 minutes) on lower temps and no steam - then you would have given the loaf the necessary boost needed to turn these smaller gas pockets into a beautiful uniform open crumb. If its taking 35-37 minutes to pop a baguettte then likely the oven is not hot enough (dont be afraid to go to 550 if thats what it takes)