So, I completed my bulk ferment. Dough was nice and pillowy. I divided and pre-shaped 2 loaves. Let bench rest a couple of minutes, and proceeded with the final shape.
The first loaf went fine, no issues. The 2nd loaf was a sticky mess. We're talking only a minute or two between shaping the two loaves, and less than 10 minutes between tipping out the dough and the final shaping. But still, could the 2nd loaf have crossed the line into being over-proofed?
Hydration 72%. It's hot and humid today.
Any insight appreciated! TIA.
Hi BethJ almost no chance that the difference could be overproofing if the 1st handled well and was able to be shaped. and the second developed the problem. Usually bench rest is the period after the dough piece has been pre shaped and is the amount of time given to the dough to relax and be less resistant to final shaping, can be anything from 10 to 30 minutes. perhaps the very short time from preshaping to final shaping saw the dough worked a little too hard. Difficult to diagnose from a description as its impossible to know whether you are light handed or heavy handed, that is really something that would need to be observed. You didn't say how the loaves turned out and a couple of pictures are more more likely to help with an accurate diagnosis
kind regards Derek
Thanks, Derek.
Interesting. I intentionally cut the resting time down after the pre-shape this time (for no reason, just to see...).
The loaves proofed in the fridge overnight. I just checked them, and the one that handled easily has slightly more rise than the other - enough to easily note the difference. I'm pretty sure I de-gassed that 2nd loaf egregiously trying to get it into shape (more flour did the trick).
I'll be baking them off shortly, and will post a pic of the final results.
I shall look forward to seeing the results, i wasn't aware that they were in the fridge awaiting baking from your initial post. Always worth experimenting if you have a big enough dough to make two loaves but treating them differently to see what difference it makes, ie completely de gassing one and trying to retain as much gas as possible with the other or extended bench rest compared with straight through. Always pays to make notes on what you have done so that you can replicate if the desired result is achieved.
kind regards Derek
Well, here's the bake. The one on the right is the one I had trouble with. I'll add crumb shots as we cut into each, the first of which will be in about 24 hours...
Perhaps the second dough warmed up more from fridge temperature. Cold dough is less sticky.
Is it possible that the second dough wasn’t stickier but in fact felt that way because you may have had remnants of the first dough on the counter, bench scraper and your hands? I find that if I’ve shaped a dough and had some contact with the sticky parts of the dough without flour, then bits of dough might stick to things and further interaction with the dough feel stickier as a result.
It is hard to imagine that the second dough could possibly have overfermented in the short while you were shaping the first one. Athough the second loaf has a flatter profile than the the first, is that because you had problems with shaping because it was sticky and not because of fermentation. Looking at the crumb to compare would help shed light on the fermentation differences if any.
I don't think it was a matter of temperature, as the shaping took place at room temp after dividing and pre-shaping the bulk ferment and before going into the fridge. I had no issues with the pre-shape of either loaf.
As to the bench, not sure? I do know that the more I tried to work the problem loaf, the gloppier it got. I did move it to a virgin spot on my work counter, too late to have any effect and to no avail. In the end, only some more flour salvaged it, and that was a band-aid at best.
Here's a shot of the crumb of the problem loaf. Came out a bit on the gummy side. I'll add a shot of the un-problematic loaf after we've eaten through this one (that one is currently in the freezer).
That looks well fermented to me and not over.
I thought my timing on the ferment was good, also. Just mystified as to why one loaf handled so much more differently than the other, given all other aspects of time, temp, etc. were the same basically.
In any case, nothing a little butter and jam won't cure! :)
The extra effort to shape it was maybe some of the problem. Perhaps it got torn or stretched too much. I jiggly lively dough is more delicate and can collapse. It looks like bottom crust should be darker to get more oven lift. Was the lower part of the DO hot enough?
I'm sure the extra handling led to the collapsed loaf. I guess my quandry is why it was so difficult to handle in the first place, when it's "sister" loaf behaved normally.
I pre-heated for an hour after the oven came to temp at 460. Here's my set up.
I bake on a large stone with a graniteware roasting pan as a lid. Your stone may have needed more time to recover heat after baking the first one. A picture of the crumb on the first one will help solve the mystery of why they behaved so differently in the shaping. Something must have been different when you divided and pre-shaped is my best guess. I didn't see the recipe. Was there spelt in the mix?
(Getting out my deerstalker hat and calabash/meerschaum pipe.)
The major clue is that the difference was noted exactly at the shaping stage.
So... the thing that caused the difference happened during the bulk ferment, the dividing up, the pre-shape, or the bench rest.
During bulk ferment, was the dough container in sunlight, or near a source of heat, or in an air current?
If so, one side of the dough mass could have fermented slightly more than the other side.
During bench rest, was the 2nd loaf in sunlight, etc.?
It was a hot and muggy day. The bulk ferment took place about 6 feet from an open door, but the bowl with the dough was enclosed in a large, well sealed, plastic bag. I started the ferment at 11:45, so the sun was at (roughly) high noon initially, and on the far side of the house by 3:00 when the ferment was done. There was no direct sunlight coming in the door.
The bench rest, however short it was, was done under loose plastic, and was done much further away from the door, and in a fairly sheltered spot on top of a cold stove.
(My other half has chimed in: The Butler Did It!)
don't stop the transfer of heat (in or out), they just slow or delay the transfer. so if it was in some kind of breeze, that might have done it.
Are you in EU? Mini Oven says there are elves there, some are good and help out, and some cause problems.
I'm in the US, but married to an Icelander. He comes with a whole parcel of elves.
Gremlins. I thought elves were a peaceful lot and mostly helpful with the dishes.