I am relatively new to sourdough bread baking. I’ve been baking a lot recently and I’m really enjoying it so I ordered 25lbs of organic type 80 flour. I have four questions:
1. should I mix this flour with Rye or Spelt for my dough? I understand that type 80 flour is already somewhere between white and whole wheat.
2. When making dough with this type 80 flour and/or with mixing in some Rye or Spelt, what is an ideal high hydration percentage?
3. While I’m experimenting with hydration levels, what does “properly” hydrated dough look and feel like before and after autolyse?
4. Is it true that when calculating hydration percentage you include the total mass of flour and water from BOTH the autolyse and the starter?
Thank you for you help!
Paul
exactly which flour did you buy?
Central Millng 100% Organic Artisan Bread Flour Type 80
Protein 13%
Ash .80%
Blend Organic Hard Red Spring Wheat
Treatment Untreated
Thank you!
1, 2, 3: Depends.
4. Yes.
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That's a good purchase. Central Milling is very highly regarded in artisan baking circles.
Your 1, 2, and 3 are kinda the wrong questions. Rather than trying to invent your own formula at this point in your learning curve, a less frustrating and liklier-to-succeed approach would be to find an established formula, and start from there.
There are no hard rules about the things you ask. It literally is "it all depends on other factors in the formula" for all three questions.
#3 depends on the kind of dough/bread you're making. And, while a video might help, text/verbal descriptions aren't worth much. Even when described by a professional baker, or professional writer, the beginning sourdough baker has nothing to relate it to.
One thing I do like to point out: someone who transitions from yeasted pan loaves to artisan/no-knead loaves has to give up some of their preconceived notions of what dough should look and feel like. And, moreover, it is very different for high-bran dough versus dough made with all white flour.
It gets even more complicated: Whole wheat, or portions of whole wheat such as T80, takes longer to absorb water than white flour, therefore the feel and appearance _changes_ (several times) during autolyse, and in the first hour or two after mixing in the starter/levain. It literally _tricks_ the beginning baker who doesn't know what to expect, or is expecting it to behave like commercially yeasted white flour recipes.
So, just follow a formula that has already been worked out, and hopefully has at least a good review or two.
Find a recipe/formula for type 80 flour, and start there. Or, if you can't find one, I know there are T85 formulas out there, so you could use one of those, with 4% whole wheat and 96% T80 flour, and that will get you close to T85.
(If your rye is whole rye, you could use that instead of whole wheat. 4% likely isn't enough to highlight the differences, other than taste.) Spelt is tricky for beginners, sticky, poor gluten, and ferments very quickly, so if you want to keep it simple, get a few good loaves under your belt before experimenting with spelt.
You'll still have to adjust the pre-existing formula to your local conditions (how much moisture is already in your flour, etc. It's never "standard".) But using a pre-existing formula gets you in the ball-park, so you can tweak things and get a decent loaf in 2 or 3 tries.
According to Chad Robertson, T85 can be approximated by mixing 50% whole wheat and 50% white flour. So if you like 45-50% WW bread, you'll like bread made with T80.
Good luck, and bon appétit.
I appreciate your feedback and advice.
I'd like to add: Bravesdad70 consider these books.
If you are technically and or process oriented (in a chemistry, biology, or engineering way): Bread by Jeff Hamelman. If I was stranded on a desert island with a bakery, this would be my go to.
If you are not technically and or process oriented (in a chemistry, biology, or engineering way): Peter Reinhart's books--which are also good starting books for the technically oriented.
I fall somewhere in between. My degrees are in history and law but my career path has veered off into IT application development which has been a life-long albeit self-taught passion.
Thank you for the recommendations and advice!
I think I bought the exact same bread. I am trying to figure out some of the same questions about hydration. The dough seems to dry out too quickly. Did you find any recipes? I called Central Milling for one and they couldn't find them on their website and had to call their tech person! I just want to make a simple hearty bread using only this wonderful flour. Even if I look for bread recipes for t85, I can't find them.
*I mean I think I bought the exact same "flour"
The "Tartine Bread" book by Chad Robertson calls for "high extraction flour" which he describes as 85% extraction.
I emailed kgbakerysupply.com, and asked if that was their type 85 or type 110, that would meet Robertson's spec. The customer service person said type 85.
("Type" means ash percent, not extraction rate, but apparently 85% happens to be the crossover point where it is "close enough" to .85% ash.)
Robertson, in his book, also says "high extraction flour" is approximated by using 50% whole wheat and 50% bread flour (or "medium strong flour" as he calls it.)
Hence, one might deduce that any formula calling for half whole wheat and half bread flour, could be approximated by using Type 85 flour. Adjustments for local conditions, including existing moisture in the flours, and the specific type of white flour used, would still be needed.
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So if your search on "type 85" and "T85" did not turn up any results, try "high extraction flour."
Bon chance.