As you can see the crumb is open towards the edges of the loaves but then gets tight in the center of the loaf. I’m not sure what the cause is. Thank you for any input. I can add formula and process info as needed.
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Blind crumb read please
The holes on the end are from the dough expanding without restraint while proofing. The white lines in the crumb might indicate that too much flour was used while shaping.
Thank you appreciate it.
It's not uncommon to see more largish bubbles near the ends of a loaf. The ends tend to get less pressure during shaping, and also, more pressure in the middle could drive gas bubbles outward. This is in addition to what MTloaf wrote.
So it's basically about shaping technique. I think, too, that even though the middle of the loaf seems to have felt more pressure during shaping, that the overall loaf looks flatter than need be - bearing in mind that we don't know the flour(s) and hydration. A shaping method that supports the middle more and with less overall pressure might give a higher loaf with a more uniform crumb.
Still, the loaf looks pretty good.
TomP
I appreciate the feedback.
72% hydration
All UBAP flour 11.5% protein
24 hr Biga/Polish (68g flour, 66g H20 1/16th tps SAF IDY) very active and floating when added to H20
-MAIN DOUGH: 500 UBAP,360 H20,1.5 SAF, 10 salt
-BULK: 4.5 hr @ 68-73°
Tripled in volume
-PROVE: 45 min Finger test ok, nice and airy, did not collapse when scored.
-BAKED: 475° DO A couple sprays of water
Lid on for 20 min off aprox 15-18
The pic is bumping up the hyd to 74% and adding 45 min of bulk.
A little more open than I was shooting for but I’m glad to see progress.
Interested in thoughts
This one looks uniform from middle to end, doesn't it? It could depend on the flour but at 72 - 72% hydration I think you could get it to make a higher loaf. Maybe degas it a little more and use a little more firmness during shaping, and maybe bulk to less than tripling...
It certainly was more uniform throughout. I will try the next one with your suggestions they make sense.
Thank you.
Bread looks tasty and delicious!
@Unofornaio, were you following a recipe from somewhere?
And, Tom, what are your thoughts on 25% IDY poolish + 4.5hr bulk after adding extra yeast? I bet you have some! 4.5 hrs sounds a bit too long for me, but I also realize this is outside my comfort zone, if I was using poolish like this I'd be using the fridge a lot. In other words my thinking is that if the bulk at room temp was shorter, say about 3 hours or even less, then there could be more oven spring and less flatness, perhaps.
-Jon
I didn't mention the yeast because using it that way is outside my experience. Yes, my reaction was that it's a lot of yeast, especially for those process times. I don't think the issue, if there is one, is lack of oven spring per se - the crumb is very open, more so than @Unofornaion says he wants - but the loaf is slumping sideways instead of expanding upwards. Yes, shorter bulk could help too, and refrigeration.
Also, a deep lengthwise score will promote sideways expansion instead of upwards.
This formula and process is one I’m actively trying to revive from my past that I honed to what I thought was perfection (I was very happy with the results) years ago.
In the early 2000’s I started a small baking operation of my own using a wood fired brick oven I built. Back then I was fairly diligent in note taking of the process and I can’t remember who or where I learned of its importance but it was and still is the best advice I was given.
The issues that have hindered its resurrection are 3 fold for me. The flour I was using at the time was from a chain here in California who it was milled by I have yet to confirm. They stopped carrying it a little before the beginning of the pandemic I recently learned.
Secondly my notebook was damaged by water and although my formula survived unfortunately my biga formula did not as well as my time frames.
The final nail is the oven which is a completely different animal than my current home oven. I have been using a DO in the interim to get as close to what I think it was then I will bake in my Mobil brick oven.
What is so frustrating here is I had a rather successful mobile woodfired pizza business that has literally been on pause since the pandemic in which I rarely had dough issues with. It was truly second nature no matter what season my dough was consistent (with seasonal variations in the formula and process)
I only do a RT process and prior (nearly 23+ years ago now) it was the same. All my doughs were done like this and I was doing about 200 loaves a weekend at a few farmers markets.
What is also frustrating and frankly a bid embarrassing is that given my previous experience with breads and then pizza I’m struggling with this to the degree I am. I feel like I just started baking last month. I guess my memory is way worse than I think it is. Lol
These are what lesser bulk AND 68% hyd was giving me. I was getting this result fairly consistently at a triple bulk volume but less time (as well as other criteria) my initial thought was fermentation is insufficient to open it up. I’m now questioning this.
Breaking my own rule of changing ONE thing at a time I upped the water AND the bulk in an effort to open it up.
It must be frustrating. One thing may be somewhat different - the wheats and the flours made from them. That could have an effect. The difference in ovens would for sure make a difference. OTOH, making bread isn't usually very sensitive to small changes in the process. Normally, a small change in the process or recipe leads to a small change in the results. That will work in your favor.
At this point I feel like I’m making progress even though I’m still not as positive as I’d like to be at diagnosing the why of the results. lol. I have done quite a few trials now and some previous knowledge is coming back while at the same time I’m essentially re learning. If that makes sense.
My thoughts are even if I was to throw out my previous formula I should have been able to get the results I’m after sooner but I will march on.
I appreciate your input and will be doing more today so I will post the results.
Ty you again