August 29, 2008 - 7:10pm
the latest video from The Back Home
The Fresh Loafers, This is the latest video where I'm working with some higher hydration (68%) doughs. Both of the breads are 'originals', and if you'd like to see the recipes you can probe around here for them or email me at the bakery. Anyway, I hope you like it. I decided to forego music this time and just add commentary. Nothing witty, strictly business.
-Mark
http://TheBackHomeBakery.com
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Nice vid Mark. It's the table though, wow that is a nice working area!
Eric
I know, I love the table. It's so nice to be able to spread things out and not have to worry about knocking things around. The whole design of the bakery/equipment was based around where the table would be and so I'd never be too far from it.
-Mark
http://thebackhomebakery.com
I had seen tables like this before and was always envious. My counters are tiled and thus unusable for bread making action (grout lines and such). I used to work on a (smallish) marble slab. Cost me about $75 at the time and works, but is still rather small. For example when making Challah I could barely fit the strands on it before braiding. A real pain.
I was talking with our handyman and he told me this would be easy to solve. My solution is described in this post: http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/7698/need-kneading-board#comment-39245
Basically bought a piece of wooden counter, put some rubber feet under it and cut out some handgrips in the sides) to prevent sliding, deal with the slightly uneven tile surface, and to make it easier to pickup. Total cost a little over $300 (but that includes paying the handyman and having the cutouts made).
Not cheap (but you won't quite have to kill for it either), but wonderful. I've had it for several months now. Wouldn't do without it. Having the space if wonderful. Working with dough on wood is wonderful too. I basically leave it in place (except when cleaning under it), and use it as counter when not making bread (but no cutting on it, and no hot pans).
--dolf
See my My Bread Adventures in pictures
great video, mark!
your videos and comments are most useful, so don't stop making them :)
Hey Mark, nicely produced video. Like your technique. Thanks for taking the time to show us all how it's done...,
Wild-Yeast
Well done and I could amost feel the dough and smell the bread. I like the way it all tucks together. Thanks!
Mini O
Hey doesn't IKEA sell a table like that?
What a HELPFULL VIDEO, THANK YOU A LOT mark
i love your bakery, i dream to have one like it here in Egypt or anywhere on the earth
i am coming to the states, do you have a vacancy for me.
Thank you Mark, God bless you
This was great, Mark. I particularly like hearing the sound of the loaf being cut to show just how crusty it is. Now, THAT'S beautiful music!
And I can't get over that you don't have a problem with the dough sticking to the counter or your hands. Are your hands wet? They don't look like they are.
-Elizabeth
Thanks for this slice of beauty, a wonderful, gorgeous how-to video. Neat trick with the pushing after folding. And the smooth slashing action again... (must locate a good knife like that!!)
This is inspirational to the max.
--------
Paul
Enjoyed it very much, Mark. Thanks for taking the time to share.
Now, if I could only teach my wettish doughs not to stick to the surface!
Wow, what perfect timing you have! Right now I've got a kind of sloppy olive dough about ready for its first fold. Of course, I've got about a 2' square to work in. :-) Thanks so much for taking the time to do this.
Where did you get the green baskets to use for the bread? I went to a restaurant supply co and got some of the red baskets that they use for burgers and FF and lined them with muslin. But they are small. Where did you get the bigger ones?
When I saw the prices of these green baskets, I almost did exactly what you did. These are made specifically for 'bread proofing' and they come in different shapes and sizes. These were from http://www.abelandschafer.com/merchant.ihtml?id=84&step=2 and they come in sets of 10. I have also bought from pastrychef.com and SFBI, the latter whom I would not recommend because of a recent yelling match I got into with their customer service department. But that's another story.
-Mark
http://thebackhomebakery.com
Thank you. I watched another one of your videos and saw the green round ones. But I couldn't see them that well. So that was when I improvised. i w ill check out the websites you suggested. But if they are really expensive I will just stick wth what I have. You have a wonderful business and kitchen. I am very jealous. :) Thank you for sharing your wealth of knowledge.
If you saw what the rest of my house looks like you'd know that I'm quite the fan of improvisation. It certainly works most of the time.
http://thebackhomebakery.com
All of your compliments are very kind. I'm going to try to address some of the individual comments here:
Hey doesn't IKEA sell a table like that? I don't know about that, but MiniO you would be interested in knowing that I shot the last scene (with the loaf alone) with a red napkin beneath it, but didn't end up using it in the video.
i am coming to the states, do you have a vacancy for me. Yes of course we have a vacancy, but only if you teach me how to make those treats you featured in your blog.
dough sticking to the counter or your hands On the first folds I put a little bit (tsp?) of flour on the table, but after that, even less or none. When folding, I'm mostly only touching the surface of the dough that had flour, so it doesn't stick to my hands (my hands are dry). After the first fold, the dough has enough strength from the ball forming that it doesn't stick much, or if it does, you can pull it off the table. Obviously, with something up at 75% hydration, you'd need more flour on the table.
Neat trick with the pushing after folding I think it helps a lot with the handling. Even with a one fold recipe like Hamelman's baguettes, it feels like it makes a big difference.
-Mark
http://thebackhomebakery.com
I also appreciate watching these videos and also love that table, you make things seem easier, I hope to pick up a few tips from your videos. Thanks again for making them.
Such a useful and informative video. Do you knead all doughs like that - stretch and fold etc? Or just wettish doughs? I've never been shown how to knead, and have a slightly different style. I do quite a lot of punching together with stretching folding and turning 180 degrees.
Patf,
The mixing for these doughs was done in a mixer, as was the 'kneading'. The folding that I'm doing does help the dough to gain strength and develop the gluten, but not to the effect of a real 'French fold' or 'stretch and fold'. Most of that is done in the mixer. The main goal of the folding here is to add volume and the strength is an added bonus. There are several posters on here who are experts in the stretch and fold technique, but I'm not one. On my kneading and folding video I use a standard (I think) technique that works for doughs that aren't too wet, maybe 65% hydration or less. Hamelman's no knead technique or the stretch and fold work well for the higher hydrations also.
-Mark
http://thebackhomebakery.com
Really great video, thanks so much for taking the time to show us. weavershouse
One more question, Mark, is that regular wheat flour dusting your bannetons?
-Elizabeth
Elizabeth,
I used to just use regular white AP flour, but as I had some close calls with a couple of loaves, I chickened out and switched to 100% white rice flour. I still have close calls, but I think that's more related to over-proofing than the flour or the bannetons.
-Mark
PS, My wife told me I need more clarification for the answer to your sticking dough question. From the first time the dough comes out of the mixing bowl until it's baked, the tops and bottoms stay the same and the same side gets the flour. So the top in your proofing bowl is the side against the flour on the table, then the side against the table becomes the top after the folding and back in the proofing bowl. During scaling again, the top from the proofing bowl goes down on the floury table and is against the table when I'm shaping. During shaping I wrap the floury side around the sticky side to seal it. So essentially, I never touch the sticky side of the dough from start to finish.
http://thebackhomebakery.com
I wondered if it was rice flour, Mark. It just seemed too easy for you to pop those proofed loaves out of the baskets.
And thank you (both you and your wife) for the extra clarification on the sticking dough. It sounds like you are doing roughly the same as I then. But I have never had the nerve to pull the dough out the way you do. I just pour slack dough onto a lightly floured board, and use my large dough scraper to fold it in half.
Also, your counter appears to be flour-free when you are doing that stretching. So it must be a very very light dusting of flour on the counter
-Elizabeth
(I wrote a post last year about how I pretend to "stretch and fold": kneading slack dough by hand - scroll down to "After the dough has rested, it's time for its first turn")
I hadn't read that blog entry of yours before, but it's very detailed and informative too. Of course part of the reason I'm able to move the dough around like that is I'm working with dough that's come out of a mixer and you're doing it by hand from the beginning. It is a very light dusting of flour for both of the folds for both doughs. Sometimes if it's a very wet dough, I'll dust the top of the dough while it's in the bowl before it goes on the counter. This of course becomes the center of the stretched out dough on the table and seems most likely to be the sticky part. I think the 'forming it into a boule' part after the folds is a significant part. It seems to me that it's the same technique as the 'no knead' technique, except it's seam side down and on the table instead of in a bowl.
-Mark
http://thebackhomebakery.com
Thank you Mark. That's high praise indeed, coming from you.
The last few times I have done my "stretch and fold", I have been basically forming a boule each time before putting it back in the bowl. But I didn't know why I was doing it or that it was possibly a further strengthening of the dough.
-Elizabeth
Elizabeth, I think my 'form it into a boule' thing at the end of the folding was just a neatness habit that I did. Only later did I realize that what it was doing to help out the strength of the dough. Sometimes as I'm editing the video or explaining something to my wife I realize a nuance or technique that I didn't realize that I do, but I feel is necessary. Make sense? It's the same with scaling. I didn't realize how picky (neurotic) I am about how I scale dough until I had someone do it for me, then I was like, "If you do this..." and "When you're cutting the dough, try to make sure..."
-Mark
http://thebackhomebakery.com
for putting together another video. You make it look so darn easy, a couple of stretch and folds and voila! Did you have formal training or are you just a natural? Have a nice weekend!
Betty
Betty,
When I started my job at a bakery in Vermont about 15 years ago, not only had I never made bread before, I had never even read about making bread. To show you how much of a rookie I was, I wore a watch to work that first day. It lasted 5 minutes. I started out mostly scaling dough for a couple of weeks, then added shaping rolls, then loaves, then baguettes, and so on. It was just through lots of observation, repetition, and the help of some patient co-workers. Plus about 1 gallon of sweat each night. Incidentally, I did have some basic culinary type schooling in college, but it was very rudimentary and didn't touch the difficult stuff like bread. Also, there have been plenty of failures, but they don't make it on YouTube. Have a nice weekend.
-Mark
http://thebackhomebakery.com
Thanks so much for sharing. Yep, it's a great table...but I've seen you work your magic on the kitchen counter in previous videos. Just wish I could somehow download some of the great smells that are in that room where you're baking those lovely loaves.
Howard - St. Augustine, FL
EDIT: P.S. Mark, I think I have your background music problem solved. I just ordered one of the new Estaban limited edition Black Beauty guitars, which Estaban sells on QVC for $179.95 (Estaban say's they're comparable to a $1,500 name brand...RIGHT!!!) and as soon as I receive the Black Beauty guitar and the video lessons I plan on cutting some CD's that may be of interest to you. Now, I've got to get busy and figure out where he buys those black costumes and hats...and go shopping for a bus...More later :>)
Thanks for the compliments.
OK, I have to admit I had to go on YouTube to look up Esteban to see who you were talking about (since we don't have a TV). That guy is such a good salesman, I ordered a couple of the 7th anniversary packages for myself (six easy payments of less than $30- you can't beat that for a handmade guitar). You do your practicing, I'll do mine and we can do an Esteban-ish duet soundtrack for the next video.
-Mark
http://thebackhomebakery.com
Great video. Your videos for shaping are all so helpful.
Shaping is just one of those things that you can't describe with words or pictures.
http://www.applepiepatispate.com
Mark, I really appreciate that you're still thinking about us on TheFreshLoaf. Your videos are the best.
Like everyone else, I noticed your table. I thought about my friend who had a large piece of marble that she'd planned to have someone cut for a work counter. I'd told her that I'd be interested in her leftover pieces. But somehow - I think one of her grandchildren drove over it - it got broken into pieces.
Oh, well. I realize that I don't have any problems finding places to work. My countertops are grouted tile, but I have a pull-out cutting board that I can use in-place or on a counter. I also have Sil-Pat - the cookie-sheet size for small jobs, as well as the kneading/rolling size. And I forgot about the wooden island cabinet with a workable surface 18"x32". Sure, everythings a little high for me (I'm just a tad over 5'), but I stand on a little kitchen stool.
So, anyway, Mark, I always look forward to your videos. I was excited for you when I saw you place your loaves on a baker's rack. You're really in business!
Rosalie
Hi! Mark:
I've been following your videos for the last 2 months and practicing the tips you presented. I'm used to making oriental breads. However, western breads have been attractive to me since they seem to be more fun and free. Making western breads used to be a nightmare to me. I guess I just didn't know the rules. After watching your demonstrations in making and shaping dough I had some fairly good outcome. Baking is the way I get rid of my stress. Love the way you work with dough. I'm April from Taiwan. Just drop by to say thanks. You are great!
Hi April,
I agree that Mark's videos is a great resource for any baker!
At the moment, I'm trying to incorporate some more variety into my own baking, and oriental breads sound exciting to me. I've never really made any, apart from some nice flat breads from the Middle East. Could you recommend me some oriental style breads to try out?
Thanks :)
Hi, hansjoakim,
I've just posted Spring onion cheese roll in my blog. That's one of the breads of oriental taste thatwe are making here. Hope you like it. lhttp://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/8501/spring-onion-cheese-roll
Apri
thanks april :)
those look marvellous! i didn't have any dinner plans for this weekend... until now.
i hope you'll find time to share more recipes with us in the future!
Wonderful video. I had the opportunity to do my folds like you showed on a yeast bread I have been making and this morning with a sweet dough. Works wonderfully and it rolled up in to a nice ball. Thanks for sharing.
Jane
Mark,
I used your video technique for shapiing a batch of sourdough this week-end. It worked just like you demonstrated & made me feel like I really knew what I was doing. A couple of my kids even watched as I shaped the dough and asked if they could give it a try.
The biggest reward came as I took the four loaves from the oven . . . I had finally done it! Exactly the crust, crumb & taste I have been after for months. I can't say that it was all due to your technique, but I will certainly continue to use your method of shaping in the future.
Thanks for sharing!
Phxdog (Scott)
I'm compiling these reples since I'm too lazy at the moment to post them separately:
Rosalie: Thanks, your excitement is contagious!
AprilSky: Thank you for the compliment, and I also would be interested in some of your recipes if you're willing to share!
Janedo: Merci for your own sharing and blogging. I've been working on Anis' recipe that you shared and will post my results in a blog in the near future.
Phxdog: Guess what? You are a real baker. Glad the techniques are working for you.
Thanks everybody; I'm always happy to hear how the techniques work (or don't) for you. Back to work...
-Mark
http://thebackhomebakery.com
I'm really looking forward to your post about the baguettes!
Jane
Thank you so much for taking the time to post your videos. Each one has been a pleasure to watch and they're always informative. I really want to try that olive loaf! You make it look so easy - I can just see the sticky mess in my future but I want to see what I can do. Thanks for the inspiration.
Marni
PS Dougal, I got clicking... 5 stars!
OK dougal, that's pretty funny. I certainly appreciate the kind words and arm twisting to get some star clicking going. I think I'm a little bit guilty myself of having read plenty of helpful posts and not rated many of them.
-Mark
http://thebackhomebakery.com
Formally rating posts is not at the top of our minds as we wend our ways through TFL. We give one another accolades in our comments. The rating system is just a little gimmick, and we forget about it, focusing instead on "the issues".
Rosalie
Hi, Mark,
I've just posted "Spring onion cheese roll" to share a bit of bread that I called oriental. I spent too much time on this entry since English really is not my language. I tried hard to say what I have to say, but I'm sure I didn't make it in 100%. Hope you won't have hard time reading my lines.^^
http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/8501/spring-onion-cheese-roll
April
April,
What a great idea. Your Spring Onion Cheese Rolls look great and I'll bet they tasted terrific. Very nice job.
Howard
Thank you from that video. A vidio is worth a million words.
I like that there is no music. I love music. But not on a learning video. Thank you.
The bread looks as good as ever.
Just curious: why the use of bannetons when you hadn't been using them before?
I have been using your Kalamata Jack recipe to make a loaves of Asiago cheese bread that are a big hit among the family.
Callie
Despite the title of the thread, this is no longer 'the latest video...' . I used the bannetons for a while to see what the results were like. After a few months of using them, I reverted back to shaping without them because I felt like I could get better shape without them. As you saw when you were here, as long as your shaping is tight and handling is correct, you can shape boules, batards, or anything else without bannetons - and still get nice loaves with whatever crumb you're looking for.
Glad you hear that your family likes your Asiago adaption to the Kalamata loaves. Cya.
-Mark
Mark, off topic but, what is the filling you used in the Portuguese Sweet bread rolls video? I know you mention it in the video, but I can't quite pick up what you say it is.
Well, come to think of it, I think you said "beans", but I guess I just want to be sure. Whatever it is, can you share the recipe?
Thank you.
You can fill the buns with just about anything, but I try to use something that's thick in consistency such as:
azuki bean paste (sweetened red bean paste available at 'oriental' markets)
ube jam (sweetened purple sweet potato also at asian stores)
coconut jam (available at the same place)
You could also fill them with shredded pork as you would with Bao/Manapua or something like that. I haven't made any of the jam fillings from scratch, I just use them out of the jar. However, looking at the recipes online, the azuki one looks pretty simple. If the stuff you make or buy looks pretty thick/dry you can thin it out with condensed milk to make it more like mashed potatoes as opposed to being dry and chunky. It should be spreadable on a soft bread.
-Mark
Thank you.
where can i find those green baskets in the uk?
Mark - you really inspire me with your videos....I had so much difficulty working with my dough....and worse, I thought I had to be work really hard on my dough...but you made it look so easy and in fact, it is easy after watching your video. The method of tucking in really helps me to shape my dough better without losing the bubbles...thank you....
I could watch that over and over again. It is mesmerizing. Thanks!!
Lol, I watch them over and over and over. I'm getting better at it, but it would take a lot of practice to get as good as that. In fact, Marks videos are something I watch every time I go to make a loaf of my sourdough bread, just to try and improve on what he has already taught me.
Joanne