November 13, 2021 - 7:43am
Calling all Florida bakers
Lots of years baking in my humid west coast Florida environment, but still have difficulty with over-hydration.
Doubt my water is any wetter than anyone else's, so has to be that the flour is damp due to the high humidity. I store flour in air-tight containers as soon as I buy it, but right from the bag it seems to have high moisture content, as my dough is always too wet following well-established hydration formulas in recipes.
Anyone from the Tampa Bay region or other high-humidity areas who has had to deal with this problem? I've made adjustments, but it's hard to nail it month to month as the humidity changes, making consistency an ongoing struggle.
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Many TFLers always "hold back" some of the water that is called for in the formula. And then add it to the dough, after mixing, or during kneading, or during the "stretch and fold" phase, only when needed, and do so "based on feel."
Probably not the answer you were looking for, but I hope it helps somewhat.
Hold back 10% water, as mentioned.
But also think of other parts of the fermentation process: reduce starter amount; use stiffer starter; reduce proofing times; use colder water; use your fridge to cool or retard fermentation and firm up the dough, etc.
Being in a place where humidity can be anywhere from 20 to 100%, I've never had a problem. But, and this is the key, ya gotta know what a proper dough feels like. Enjoy!
So sounds like your flour is not being affected at all by the humidity, even though you are seeing up to 80 degree swings.
I read an article at www.genuineideas.com/ArticlesIndex/flour.html that shelf flour is about 13.5 percent water by weight. The author dried 100 grams at 33 percent RH for 6 hours and noted that it lost 8.5 percent of its weight as a result.
The author has a chart that shows flour water weight gain by humidity and is shows flour in 100 percent humidity is about 11-12 percent heavier than flour in 20 percent humidity. Of course a lot depends on how long flour is stored in a given humidity and how air tight it is kept, etc., but there seems to be potential for a lot of difference.
I Suppose that technically, unless I have a baseline (know the percentage of water in the flour), I can't ever truly know what a a 70 percent dough feels like, can I?
Seems a bit like do you and I see the same shade of red when we look at the same strawberry. Somebody in Arizona has got to have a different notion of what a 70 percent dough feels like that what it feels like at my location, as even though our water always weights the same, our flour isn't likely to. Humidity where I am as I write this post is 94 percent.
Don't want to geek out, but I'm going to be embarking on large-volume bread baking soon and am just trying to establish a system to ensure the most consistent loaves. I see developing feel as important, but more for detecting when something is wrong/just not quite right with a dough than being able to confidently proclaim that this week's batch of dough is the same as last week's.
Start with less water. If you want something similar to others' 70% hydration, try aiming for 60%, for example.
Everywhere in the world all flour is different. Any extreme condition like high humidity will cause additional problems, but starting with less water and adjusting if it feels like it needs a little more is the simplest solution. It's not a problem if the dough even turns out more dry than you'd like - the bread will still be great, although a little different. But you'll learn something, and will be able to adjust next time.
I'm sure it is. But there's another thing I know that most don't - and that is hydration to the tenth of a % (a most misunderstood parameter) is most comical.
As far as large scale baking goes - you're in the wrong place. As this now more than appears to be a business question - best of luck - you're gonna need it Enjoy!
Autolyse at a hydration that makes a stiff dough. Then when adding the salt and starter slowly add in more water till it feels right.
I live on the east coast of Florida, like on the ocean. I am a warm bodied person so when I walk outside on a hot day it's like I took a dip in the pool after 10 minutes.
I really can't compare baking to anywhere else though. All I can say is that I have always had to use intuition. I have almost exclusively been baking with freshly milled flour and that is a whole different ball game. Now you have me curious as to what it's like to bake in somewhere such as New Mexico.
The times my bread has come out best have always been the times I enjoyed the dough... You ever just finish kneading and think to yourself "that's a nice dough"? Those are usually the times my bread comes out the best. I give it a final slap for good luck during first rise, the chef's kiss if you will.
After kneading for 2 minutes you can pretty much tell if it'll be too dry or wet, the remainder of kneading will simply make that same consistency a bit tighter and more coherent when strengthening the gluten. I really haven't paid attention to this, or the time of day I bake.
Currently 70% humidity with the sun down during the Fall...
I live in the Tampa area so I know successful baking can happen. There are just a few things that would be helpful for you to know.
1.Recipes are not formulas. ( "well-established hydration formulas") In baking, no matter how carefully the ingredients are weighed and measured, it is still a "recipe" and not a "formula". Some judgement is called for and that is especially so when the environment is variable. 100% humidity one day and 40% a few hours later where I am.
2. Flour can behave very differently-crop to crop and bag to bag- whether it is the same or different brands. Best to use the same brand for the most consistent behaviour (but not identical). Flour humidity is not usually that game-changing a factor in most recipes for breads. Pastries & pie crusts might be a different story.
My recommendations are simple.
1. Hold back some liquids.
2.Use time. Mix the dough. Let it sit for 10-20 minutes. Remix and see where the dough is at-moisture wise. Add/don't add water as appropriate. ALWAYS mix/knead to windowpane. This is how you tell that the liquid & flour has done it's job.
3. Get used to handling moist dough. (Whichever method works: Damp-not wet hands,use a bench scraper, oiled hands and bench,or a LITTLE extra flour) .Almost all breads can be successfully made with a wide variety of hydration. Sometimes it is the handling or shaping that determine the success of a loaf. Also, a moister loaf will need to bake a little longer to drive out sufficient moisture.
4. If you really think it is necessary, keep your flour in airtight bins in an air conditioned space. Monitor the house humidity so you know what works when a loaf is successful. The humidity level the 24-48 hours before you use the flour is what you want to pay attention to.
Share a specific recipe and pics for the best advice.
EDIT:
My recommendations are based on recipes using AP flour. I made that assumption.
If you are using WW or rye flour there is a whole different set of recommendations. There are also greatly different recommendations for spelt,einkorn,GF,etc.
RE-EDIT:
My advice was for a home-baker. Commercial-sized baking is definitely out of my expertise. There are professional bakers on this site. You may capture their assistance if you title the post appropriately for that subject. A few of them started baking with guidance here and went on to establish baking as a business. Good luck!.
Thanks, all
The aim of the question was about maintaining consistency, week to week, whether its a couple loaves or 100.
Baking in a wood-fired oven has its own list of variables, so eliminating as many as possible on the front end before loading the oven is my goal.