New Rofco B5 Oven- It Arrived
Hey Folks,
Wanted to post my thoughts on my new Rofco B5 oven.
Purchased the unit from Pleasant Hill Grain at the site below. Great folks to deal with and several of their customer rep's worked with me through all my questions.
My contact was a nice lady named Sarah. The oven was ordered and shipped out to me the next day. The shipping was free and I didn't get tagged with sales tax. I highly recommend Sarah or others there.
http://pleasanthillgrain.com/rofco-electric-stone-oven-b5-bread-oven
ARRIVAL:
Arrived on a lift-gate truck in a crate that appeared 'bomb-proof'. The crate even had a 'tip-over' vial on the side that would change color if the crate was dropped on it's side.
The oven was doubled tied down and had a little forklift skid. I think it could have been 'air-droped' onto my driveway and survived.
Not a scratch on the little oven…. even the plastic on the SS came off easy.
SET-UP & FIRE-UP:
I set it up on a metal toped table on our patio. I wired a 240v / 20 amp AWG 10 circuit to provide service. Then installed a thermocouple inside the oven and followed the manual for initial start-up. It came up to 230c in approximately 1.5 hours. Seems to consume about 1400 watts while heating.
TEST BAKES:
First one…..
My first bake was Sourdough. I make my dough towards the low hydration side and the final proof is kinda short. The oven temp was set at 210c (about 450f), initial steam three shots during the first 4 minutes, then after 10 minutes the vent was opened, temp was dropped to 50c (110f) and the vent remained open for the last 15 minutes of the bake.
The Baguetts seemed to have good spring, color and open crumb. The bottoms were not burnt and crust was nice and crackly.
Second one….
This bake is what I call 'Country French' Baguettes (normal hydration). Again the same procedure as the Sourdough. Another good bake or at least I am happy.
I'm pretty happy with these. I should have left them in the oven for, maybe, another 5 minutes.
STEAMING METHOD:
For my steaming I purchased a little steam generator from Amazon. Did a few modifications to it and have been using it in our gas range oven. So when I got the Rufco I fitted the steamer with a copper tube nozzle that will fit into the door vent. This allow me to steam the dough without opening the oven door.
A couple of quick bursts of steam during the first 10 minutes of the bake works great. I need to remember to close the little vent each time.
OVERALL INITAL IMPRESSION:
This little oven beat the heck out of using a stove range oven. First, on a range oven you cannot control the venting, need to use a 'dutch-oven' or inverted a deep steam table pan to cover the dough for good color/crust, and steaming is always a chore. Did I mention crawling around on the floor.
The only down side for the Rufco so far is that the thermostat is inaccurate. At 230c the actual temp is well above 260c (>500f). I use 210c for warm up and baking. It is about 450f. Most thermostats I have dealt with have always been adjustable via a small screw inside the dial shaft, but not here. This is not a large problem. Just something to get used to.
Other that the above I can not find any other issues. It does exactly what I need and it is very fun to use.
I highly recommend the oven and Pleasant Hill Grains. I would like to thank 'drogon' and the others that posted comments and information which help me decide.
Let the fun begin…….
Edited To Post: Now that I have about 8 heat soaks to 230c the thermostat has settled in. For my bakes I set the thermostat a 220c and after 1.5~2 hours the oven has reached a stable target temp of 450 degrees fahrenheit and during the heat cycles the temperature swings are about 10~12f above and below 450f. Can't ask for much better than that.
I use a pump-up water bottle for injecting water vapour - I have 3 decks in mine, so using the vent holes would only be practical for the top shelf - I just spray water into each cavity as I'm closing the door and it seems to have a good enough effect.
The stone will stain when you put a sloppy pizza on it... Not that I've done that, of-course, but ... :-)
I've heard of others using baking parchment for pizzas to keep the stones clean. Mine came with 3 metal trays (and I ordered 3 more) and silicone lining material which is excellent for doing things other than breads on.
Happy baking!
-Gordon
Gordon,
Thanks for the response. And you are correct about using a 'steamer' with only one vent on your door. But it sounds as if your technique is working for you.
Hey,,,, if you do bake up some pizza let me know how it turns out…. (temp's, type of pan or stone?)
Good luck!
Mike
Thanks for the photos and the reviews. As you know, there are not that many reviews of this oven, and it is a pretty significant investment, so I am sure others will appreciate your info. BTW, the photo of the oven on the pallet in your garage made it look like it was over 3 feet deep, the photos on the countertop made it look much more normal sized.
barryvabeach,
Yes you are correct about the investment $$….. my wife has attached a weekly deduction from my beer allowance to offset the price…… I guess that I'm worth it and a few less brewskis won't hurt me.
Bottom line is that I really enjoy the little oven and isn't finding some enjoyment in life what it is all about.
Thanks for the comment!! "Bake-ON….."
Deleted
I was seriously considering this oven for a while and did quite a bit of sleuthing on the web about it. I found many comments and reviews that the deck temp wasn't consistent for many people and breads would good inconsistently within a loaf (burn on one end or another). They would talk of using temperature guns to measure the deck or hooked up probes, etc. They totally geeked out on it. And in the end they found the temperature control very inconsistent. When they went back to the company (bought direct) they had a lot of push back, etc. Given the price point i decided to sit tight and not buy it. Even in your post you mentioned that you noticed the temp wasn't what it should be. I very much hope it works out. But could I ask you to post an update at some point on this thread in a few months and let us know how it's going? Many thanks! Would love to have one if it turns out well! Best..
bread1965,
Sorry that the 'thread' that started in June 2014 placed you on the fence, so to speak. I can and will only relate what I know or have first had experience with.
My B5 now has six 475f heat soaks. Tomorrow will be my fifth bake and seventh heat soak. It will be a highly hydrated Ciabatta. All of the heat soaks were under two hours.
The oven now reaches my target temp of 450f for a bake with the thermostat set at 220c. The thermostat will cycle 10-12 degrees fahrenheit either side of the target temp of 450f. Can't get much better than that and I speak from expereiance. Honestly if you were to check most residentual oven settings you'd find none of them accurate. I've always had to calibrate mine.
I did read, heed, and do what the instructions suggest for door operation. Do not slam the door!!! I have seen people that will 'kick' or 'shoulder' slam their home oven door close. Makes me crazy like,, fingernails on a chalk board.
I am still very, very pleased with my little Rofco B5. And I'm not worried about the warranty that is through Pleasant Hill Grain. After working with the folks there, (Sarah and others) I have large confidence that should I have a problem they will respond. I feel bad that the fellow overseas that had issues, but I think it is OK now (?).
Buy a Rofco, follow the start-up instructions, put a inexpensive oven thermometer on the stone temperally, fire it up a few more times, log the settings on the thermostat dial that apply to how you bake, remove the &$@# thermometer, AND have fun!
I'll keep you posted as I progress, but for now all is great! Thanks for you comment…...
Post some pictures as you go alone.. i'm sure we'd all like to see how it goes! I'm up in Canada so I'll have to look for a dealer up here! Thanks very much!
Mike
Thanks for the review. Very interesting to hear someone's first hand experience. I have been contemplating buying one for years now!
Is it possible for you to send a pic of the plug and the wall socket you are using? Just want t see if i would have to hire an electrician first.
I also heard you can buy steamer trays for the inside, did you decide not to get them? if so why>
Thanks in advance!!
Great post!
MJ
MJ,
I hand built a wonderful gas fired brick bread oven in Baja. Used it for years, but when we moved back to the states in April I had to leave it down there. Broke my heart, but it would have cost way too much $$ to ship it back to Florida.
Once here I tried and tried to continue baking in a gas range oven, but it just was not working! Found the Rofco's and fell in love. Decided on the little B5 as it fits our weekly bakes and it has proved excellent.
I didn't get the steam trays because the B5 is a single deck and using the vent hole and my steam generator I am able to sufficently steam my bakes. But I see the nesessity for the trays in the other models.
I set the B5 up on our screened and covered patio. Ran a 240v 20amp curcuit from our panel into the patio. (I can't remember if I 'pulled a permit' or not, oh my!). Anyway the following photo's shows the plug, receptacle, and wire run.
This a 20amp 240v receptacle….. all the 'big box' stores carry them along with the PVC 'stuff'.
This is the 20amp plug that Pleasant Hill Grains has on the B5. I don't know about the other models.
This is my wire run into the patio. It is on a 20amp breaker in the panel.
Also I'm attaching a link to the brick oven I built in Baja and had to leave. It's kinda fun to look at but it was an expensive endevor and the B5 works just as good if not better……..
Again,,, thanks for the post….
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5asqcOiHbelOXlQZUwwZ0hFNzg/view?usp=sharing
Thanks so much for posting the pic of the plug/socket. This is very helpful! based on your info, I know i will need to do some electrical work before hand. However, the harder part is convincing my wife first!!
Very impressive brick oven too... I can understand how hard it must have been to leave it!
Thanks again for this post. I really appreciate you sharing your Rofco experience.
MJ,
First I am fortunate to have a great wife,,,, that said, she was faced with several issues…. 1. put up with my eternal fuss'n about the range oven, 2. let me build another brick oven, or 3. let me purchase the Rofco.
I think she felt that all my 'drama & fuss'n' using the range oven would drive her crazy and building another brick oven would cost more than the Rofco. So,,, with few stipulations she signed off on the Rofco.
I thanked her and told her that I was very happy with her decision. Otherwise I would be single again and have to post an advertisement:
"Wanted,,, New Wife. Needs to own a stone oven. When applying please send photograph of Oven."
I may need to hired you as a consultant to convince my wife first, before i call an electrician and buy the oven!
MJ,
Just keep working on it. It'll happen….. Just do not get into trouble…...
Stay happy!
Hey Folks,
Today baked my Ciabatta 'Slipper-Loaf". It is a 80% hydrated dough with a12hr Poolish and I don't make it with a large open crumb. Someone I live with doesn't like to make a sandwich with the mayo squirting out onto her blouse or jam dropping out. Fine with me as long as she is happy!
I fired the Rofco B5 up set at 220c. Under two hours later it was stable at 450f. I stuffed the Ciabatta into the oven. Gave it 2 good steams during the first 3 minutes. Then after 10 minutes opened the steam vent and turned the thermostat down to 50c for the reminder of the 25 minute bake……..
Life is good…..!
Nice looking loaf, though now you have that great oven, you are going to have to get a peel so you can bake right on that stone.
barryvabeach,
Good to hear from you again. I've been working up to using the stone. Kinda wanted to get a feel for the Baguette rack. As to the Ciabatta even at only 80% hydration it can be a pain to slid off a peel so I 'chickened-out'. The stone is too pretty now…..
The next post down I've posted the bake from today and I used the stone so that you would be happy…. Grin.
Actually the Rofco shipped in with a Peel, Silicone/Fiberglass matt (Splat-like), and a oven steel insert. Very nice! I sanded a little on the peel and gave it a coat of oil. Nice touch to include them.
I thought the peel that was supplied with mine was a bit "toy" like - and no-way could I use it to load up my B40 with 12 lots of dough in a sensible time!
Mine was also supplied with full-size metal trays - simple affairs - just steel sheet with the edges cut & folded up. I ordered a 2nd set with mine and glad that I did at the time as I've used them for making big batches of rolls (150 at a time, 25 to a tray) I seasoned the trays first - more or less as per the instructions, but clean, cover in oil, bake, wipe down and repeat. A bit stinky with the oil (rapeseed) burning off, but no big deal.
Also the silicone mats - these are great - so what I do is rather than use a full-size loading board (think big peel the same size as the oven floor!) I put these onto the counter, tip the dough onto them, then use my home-made full-size loading board to lift these into the oven. That way I can prepare 3 of them with 12 lots of dough, then load them all into the oven in well under a minute to minimise the door open time.
(My loading boards are 520mm by 470mm - so they fit into my Lincat one way and the Rofco the other way)
And I don't know if this makes a difference or not, but it feels like the right thing (if there is a right thing!) after 12-15 miutes when I open the vents, I also open the door and do the magicians trick of removing the silicon sheets, leaving the breads directly in contact with the stone for the remainder of their baking time. It seems to help remove any "glaze" that the wet dough sitting on the sheets sometimes gives.
The BIG downside of the B40 is that the bottom shelf is, well at the bottom, so you need to get down on your knees to get stuff in/out of it. I'm planning to have a plinth made up for mine - about the height of one shelf to move the whole thing up a bit, but not so high that the top isn't usable for storage, proofing, etc.
-Gordon
drogon,
I kinda envy you'll with the three and four stone ovens. But I just do small bakes and I can live with the little B5.
Good plan to raise the B40 up. That should make load and unloading much easier. Sounds like you are all 'dialed' in.
Good Bake'n……!
First off,,, I'm back to have'n one large time bread making again…..
Today I did two 40% Rye Batards and tossed them on the stone. (Using the Silicone matt that came with the oven.)
The B5 was preheated to 220c (450f'ish). It was at target temp in 1.75 hour and it cycled a couple of times before I loaded the Batards.
I loaded them in, did three small steams during the first 3 minutes, then at 10 minutes I opened the steam vent and turned the thermostat down to 50c.
I let the Batards continue to bake for a total of 20 minutes.
Oven was, again, great and here are the Batards.
Where are the heating elements?
Not sure about the B5, but in the B40, they're over and under.. So from the top down, you have:
element 1
top cavity
top stone
element 2
middle cavity
middle stone
element 3
bottom cavity
bottom stone
element 4
There are 2 thermostats - elements 1 and 2 on the top thermostat )in the top cavity) and 3 and 4 on the bottom one (thermostat in the bottom cavity). That allows you to heat up just the top cavity if you like - and I often do this just for cakes or small batches.
One down-side of this is that as the heat from the bottom element has no-where to go but up, the bottom slab is slightly hotter than the others (contrary to what you might think!) so after a week of experiments, I now run the bottom thermostat 10C cooler than the top one.
Every oven has it's "personality" - it just takes a bit of time to work it out and work with it.
-Gordon
drogon,
You nailed that right on the money. Every oven I ever had, be it a range oven or stand alone had their own little glitches.
And every one of them I had to calibrate the thermostat to get a true 500f. All the thermostat I had to adjust had a small adjustment in the 'Dial' shaft. Wasn't hard, just a fiddley pain in the rear.
I checked out my B5's thermo shaft and it does not have the same type shaft adjustment. No biggie, I just know what centigrade marks on the dial get me to my target temp's.
Oh my B5 has a top and undertone element.
Easy, peizy…..
Here is a drawing of most thermo's I experienced.
Most capillary type thermostats are .. well ... good enough, but that's about it.
I've just put some digital control on my cheapie domestic oven as an experiment and its working well. Below is a graph of it on the capillary controller - the dial was set to 180C:
Yellow and Red traces are at the back on opposite sides (the red is closest to the capillary tube), blue is middle front. You can see when I loaded it with a cake and checked it...
Need to make some graphs showing the digital control (raspberry Pi powered if anyone's interested)
-Gordon
Gordon,
You are correct… the capillary thermo is timeless. They never seem to ever consistently hit the same target temp. And are subject to all kinds of outside influences. But they are dependable year after year. And hey, we are not baking Space Shuttle tiles. We have considerable leeway….
Like the work you put into plotting the PID performance. I've put some of them on friends kilns. Nowadays the prices for them are affordable, but made in China……… (Isn't everything?)
Here is the one that I like. Easy to set up and dependable, but for the little Rofco the old-style thermo is just great now that I know how to set my target temps.
Keep on having fun….
that's not from a PID controller - that graph was the existing capillary one. I'm still playing with the code but when I'm happy I'll generate a graph from the Pi doing PID control. I'm using a near identical SSR to that kit above. My plan is to eventually control all my ovens this way - maybe...
-Gordon
Sorry I miss-inturperded your post…….
The heating elements are underneath the stones (or stone, in case of the B5).
My B40 is churning out 6 whole wheat breads as we speak and I've had it since May this year. The temperature deal indeed is not entirely accurate but then again for me that is only something I had to get used to. Other than that I'm pretty happy with it.
I'm using the steam trays that come with it (at least they do here in The Netherlands).
Good that you're liking your new B5, Mike!
alefarendsen,
Thanks for the good post. And yes I'm luv'n the little Rofco. And your oven seems to be all broken in and no issues. Good stuff.
I think that mine is over the initial hump for issues. After all the ovens are pretty basic in that no 'whistles & bells' like fancy electronics, computers, etc. Heck, mine only has five moving parts…… Door, spring/ball latch, two little fans, and a thermostat. All of these parts have been around for many, many years. So I feel that there is not much that can or will go wrong. And if so, drill a few pop-rivets out and replace the element or thermostat. Oh,,, the light blub, but it is not moving….
Today I baked some Bahn Mi baguetts for lunch sandwiches. Oven once again preformed great……..
Hi!
Sorry to comment on an older thread but I believe your post still continues to very helpful for new Rofco buyers/users today.
I'm interested in your steaming method. Would you be able to tell me more about the modifications you made to your steamer and also what type of nozzle you got for it? Is this still the method of steaming you are using? I like the idea of using something that mimics a steam injector rather than using the garden sprayer which creates quite aggressive bursts of steam, but I wonder which is more effective. Obviously the steamer is a bigger investment...
Thanks for your great post and very grateful for any help you can offer re my question!
I have the B20 and use the steam pads...did you order any or are they too big for the B5? Kat
Thank you! I don't have a steam pod, I am considering it but have heard many people say that they are not necessary and that they take up too much valuable space on the stone. I am trying with the garden sprayer method first, but am interested in hearing more about this steamer method as it's the first time I've heard of someone using such a device with the Rofco.
and just had a look...
How many loaves are you planning to get in there?
I have three decks in the B20 and use a steam pad at the top and at the bottom and spray a little bit in addition as I don't have a tray in the middle but Rofco say you should...
This has worked quite well and most of my recent bakes in the last months have been made in the B20. I don't mind too much the pads using up the space as I often bake 2-3 breads at the moment and are happy with that...
When you use the sprayer just be aware that you don't get it onto the little light bulb..I managed to crack mine but is fine baking even with cracks and will order a new one but fine for now...I've found it quite tricky to avoid the bulb as the B20 is smaller than the B40 and even on the Rofco instagram posts there appear a number of people who had the same experience so I was kind of mentally prepared...
You can message me directly, if you want and have more questions... Kat
Hi Kat,
Ah yes from my reading I got the impression that everyone who has a Rofco has cracked their light at some point, but it's good to know that you can keep baking in it. As long as it doesn't shatter when it cracks and ruin the bread underneath..
I'm hoping two med sized, maybe 3 small.
That's really kind of you and thank you so much! I will def bear in mind as I will most likely have more questions :)
elsie,
Thank you so much for looking at my old thread and having a question. I'm up to my 'ears' right now in a project, but give me a day and I'll get you the mod's for the little steam generator that I'm still using. It is a worthwhile investment and does not shatter your light globe. (I also did just that with a mister before I got the steamer.)
Be patient I'll be back.......
Mike
Hi Mike!
Thank you for replying so quickly and of course, if you could reply whenever you are able to I would be most grateful! :)
I'll look forward to learning more from you in due course.
Elsie
Elsie,
Sorry for the delay. I've been up to my rear in Alligators down here in Florida. Anyway, here is the set-up on the steaming method that I have been using since May 2015.
I place the bread dough into the preheated B5 (210c), give one long blast of steam, close the vent, 5 min later another long blast (3 sec), close vent, and another 6 min then I open the vent and drop the temp to 180c or 190c depending what I'm baking.
Tips for the steamer: If you aren't going to use it for a while drain all water out. Use only distilled water. Turn it on about 3 or 5 minutes prior to placing dough in the oven. Every month or so use some white vinegar and water to clean it out. Do a couple of 'trigger' bursts before you steam inside the oven.
I'd be interested in how it would work in the two larger models of the oven. (??) But in my little B5 guy it is great!
So,,, go forth and burn some flour. In other words have fun!!!!
Mike
THE STEAMER I'M USING
STEAMER.JPG
NOZZLE OFF.JPG
NOZZLE.JPG
Oven Steamer.png
Hi Mike,
Wow, it was so good of you to go to the effort of explaining that all to me and including such helpful photos! I'm really so very grateful for people like you and your generous spirit. Thank you so much!
You've come up with what looks like an excellent alternative for an expensive steam injector oven! I'm not sure I'm up to the task for the metal work involved in modifying the nozzle..but perhaps it isn't as difficult as it appears.
I'm not sure if that was a figure of speech re the alligators, but if not it sounds intriguing! Anyway, thanks again for taking time out of your busy schedule to write back :)
Elsie